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What Has RTG Been Up To? - RTG Social Media News Discussion Thread

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#21 toremygg

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 15:09

No to mention the havoc it wreaks on Wiki writing...
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#22 Alcarmo

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 23:27

Very well said, AstralTraveller  ;)

I totally agree - I appreciate that RTG offers us to affect the story, but I´m not sure if I want to affect it that much  :huh:

You know...with great power, comes great responsibility  B)

 

Anyway...I´m afraid its kinda late for our suggestions....as this is gonna be the big part of the game and it´s been already implemented,

but I need to tell my wish before it´s too late - don´t let me kill someone important or someone who I like, ok?  ;) what an unrealizable wish, huh?  :D


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#23 Alcarmo

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 23:40

 

A couple of funny vine videos from yesterday :D

 

11th of February:

  • @RagnarTornquist: Total bot freak-out. #DFC #pathfindingmishaps https://vine.co/v/MWPjueHxAVx (x)   
  • Bot: "Oh my..., that´s Zoë, the girl who escaped! I have to call up reinforecements! Whoaaaa...."
  •  
  • @RagnarTornquist: The logical next step: bots with pigeon brains. #DFC https://vine.co/v/MWPIp1EmjUx (x)
  • Bots: "Beep-zang, beep-zang...don´t put up any resistance, miss Castillo. You´re still visible to the EYE! "

:blush:

 


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#24 AstralTraveller

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 10:34


Anyway...I´m afraid its kinda late for our suggestions....as this is gonna be the big part of the game and it´s been already implemented,

but I need to tell my wish before it´s too late - don´t let me kill someone important or someone who I like, ok?  ;) what an unrealizable wish, huh?  :D

 

while conceptually I agree that they can't simply make this aspect of the game disappear, there's a lot of opportunity for balancing. and, if a choice is only superficial, then it can be removed even during beta without too much fuss. so there's still hope :D


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#25 wandrew

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 11:21

No to mention the havoc it wreaks on Wiki writing...


OMG WE WERE ALL THINKING IT RIGHT
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#26 Avernus

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 00:59

Yeah, it makes me a bit uneasy too. I have this need to know what really happened.


Let me tell you why you're here.You're here because you know something. What you know you can't explain, but you feel it. You've felt it your entire life, that there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there, like a splinter in your mind, driving you mad. It is this feeling that has brought you to me. Do you know what I'm talking about?

 

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#27 Happy Tree

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Posted 14 February 2014 - 19:54

If you want to be confused, just ask a group of people what they think. If you want to please nobody, start by trying to please everybody.

 

The artist expresses what is in the heart! And people either like it or not.

 

I mean, I would sure love my doppel to be worshipped as the coolest character in the game, but the deal is that she will just look as much like how I specify as the parameters allow. And that's it. I trust the artist to do the best he can do! If I didn't, he'd never have got has hands on my moolah in the first place ;)


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#28 Rexx

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 14:06

Yeah I quite agree on the worries about these multiple decisions. In fact I am happy that they are ambitious but...

 

Will that lead to several endings ? I'd prefer a single ending, because multiple endings would weaken the game, as the scenario is one of the biggest strenght of the series.  

 

RTG are a small team, in comparison to Bioware for example, who have a HUGE team for games like Mass Effect, so that they can afford creating many different paths.

So we can wonder if it's a good idea to create so many paths. Can they handle that ? 

 

Or maybe it's easy to do and I'm talking rubbish.  :blush:



#29 wandrew

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 23:19

The talk has all been very much about a single ending, just a few (but now maybe more) divergent paths to get there.



#30 Barentity

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Posted 15 February 2014 - 23:45

No story based game can handle that many scenarios coherently


Really? Why? There aren't many games, besides RPGs, that have meaningful player choice, but I think this is an exciting thing for DFC and I'm quite surprised that multiple people have posted to express their misgivings about it. (Although I do understand the misgivings.)

As for the wiki, that was what I was thinking when I read the tweet. I also started wondering whether we should come up with a division of labour plan so that we can tackle the task of mapping out the story decision points and their consequences in an efficient manner for the purpose of the wiki, assuming that RTG doesn't hand over a design document. But it would probably be more fun doing it ourselves anyway. Time for a distributed player choice mapping algorithm.

#31 AstralTraveller

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Posted 16 February 2014 - 09:40

Really? Why?

 

Different scenarios mean different events, different character paths and different dialogue. You can cleverly reuse stuff, but if you're too clever, you'll become transparent, and the choices will start to mean nothing. If you're thinking about dozens of scenarios, it can easily mean 2-3x work on the game.

 

There aren't many games, besides RPGs, that have meaningful player choice, but I think this is an exciting thing for DFC and I'm quite surprised that multiple people have posted to express their misgivings about it. (Although I do understand the misgivings.)

 

Like I said above, I don't want to forge my own story :)


Too many hands on my time, too many feelings
Too many things on my mind
When I leave I don't know what I'm hoping to find
When I leave I don't know what I'm leaving behind

 


#32 Barentity

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 02:30

Different scenarios mean different events, different character paths and different dialogue. You can cleverly reuse stuff, but if you're too clever, you'll become transparent, and the choices will start to mean nothing. If you're thinking about dozens of scenarios, it can easily mean 2-3x work on the game.

It certainly creates more work for the developers, but it's hardly a problem of exponentially increasing complexity. If there are n decision points in the game and each decision point has x options, then yes, there are x^n game permutations but that doesn't mean there's x^n times the work involved. Choice 1 might set a flag and at a particular point in the game, the flag is checked and if it's true it plays an extra line of dialogue - that's not a lot of work. Some choices might interact with each other (i.e. the outcome depends on the values of multiple choices) but most of them probably won't.

#33 Tina

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:25

Okay, I've been lazy.. Sorry!

 

14 feb:

  • @RagnarTornquist: Today’s theoretical Friday game jam produced #FappyBird by @DagScheve: Keep that hand moving up and down the pipe at a controlled pace. (x)
  • @DagScheve: @RagnarTornquist Friday, innit? (x)

15 feb:

  • @RagnarTornquist: Beginnings and ends are easy to write: it’s the middle part that kicks my ass every time. (x)
  • @RagnarTornquist: I never knew Hindi had so many lovely swear words. Mira is turning into the filthiest character I’ve ever written. #Chapters (x)

18 feb:

  • @RagnarTornquist: Thanks for the constant reminder, @idriselba. (picture) (x)
  • @RagnarTornquist: Best thing about writing speculative fiction is that you can skimp on research, invent facts & never have to deal with any code of ethics. (x)
  • @RagnarTornquist: On the other hand, I did spend three hours today doing detailed research on German, Czech and French slang words so…yay, I win? Somehow? (x)

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#34 Guyra

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 10:50

 

@RagnarTornquist: Today’s theoretical Friday game jam produced #FappyBird by @DagScheve: Keep that hand moving up and down the pipe at a controlled pace. (x)

 

 

Hahaha! Awesome! xD


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#35 AstralTraveller

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 11:08

It certainly creates more work for the developers, but it's hardly a problem of exponentially increasing complexity. If there are n decision points in the game and each decision point has x options, then yes, there are x^n game permutations but that doesn't mean there's x^n times the work involved.

 

Yes, and this is why I didn't say that two dozen binary choices mean 16 million times the extra work - only 2-3 times :)

 

Choice 1 might set a flag and at a particular point in the game, the flag is checked and if it's true it plays an extra line of dialogue - that's not a lot of work. Some choices might interact with each other (i.e. the outcome depends on the values of multiple choices) but most of them probably won't.

 

And you would call a decision point 'significant' if it results in a different line of dialog? I certainly wouldn't. And I think significant choices can't help but interact - not everything with everything, of course, but ones regarding the same character would have to, in my view.

 

 

Okay, I've been lazy.. Sorry! (,,,)

 

Well, we forgive. Especially as these were really el-oh-el quality :D


Too many hands on my time, too many feelings
Too many things on my mind
When I leave I don't know what I'm hoping to find
When I leave I don't know what I'm leaving behind

 


#36 Alcarmo

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 19:19

while conceptually I agree that they can't simply make this aspect of the game disappear, there's a lot of opportunity for balancing. and, if a choice is only superficial, then it can be removed even during beta without too much fuss. so there's still hope :D

 

In Balance and Hope we trust, yeah  :D

 

For the others who don´t understand my concerns....I play TLJ and DC to follow the story, to watch it, to enjoy it, to be part of it...

but not to create it in my own way......Ragnar and his team are the creators and this is the way I like the most  B)

 

  • @RagnarTornquist: I never knew Hindi had so many lovely swear words. Mira is turning into the filthiest character I’ve ever written. #Chapters (x)
  • @RagnarTornquist: On the other hand, I did spend three hours today doing detailed research on German, Czech and French slang words so…yay, I win? Somehow? (x)

 

 

- I really look forward to get to know Mira  :D can´t imagine that anybody can use more swear words than Burns Flipper - what´s more - she´s a girl!  :lol:

- and I´m curious in the same way to check czech swear words, of course..... trial by fire, huh?  :P  :D  


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#37 khh

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 21:05

I've actually wondered several times why the cool tweets weren't being posted :) But I figured it'd be better not to infringe on your territory.


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#38 Teller

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 03:34

  • @RagnarTornquist: I never knew Hindi had so many lovely swear words. Mira is turning into the filthiest character I’ve ever written. #Chapters (x)

Woohoo!  Now I won't have to bug my friend to teach me Hindi swear words!  She so doesn't want me swearing in Hindi, but now Ragnar is helping me. :D

 

And everything else Ragnar said about writing is so very true.


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#39 Tina

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 05:33

I've actually wondered several times why the cool tweets weren't being posted :) But I figured it'd be better not to infringe on your territory.


It's due to Internet being unstable at home, (especially) in the evenings. And tweets being posted while I'm at work, or sleeping. Just circumstances in general.

So seriously, "infringe" all you want! It's first come, first serve and wasn't supposed to be "posts exclusively by me" :-) the only thing I ask is that you (or others) include the permalinks for the tweets (or let me edit your post later to add them) - otherwise the summaries get very tedious (infinite scrolling) :-)
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#40 UPtimist

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 10:34

 


14 feb:

  • @RagnarTornquist: Today’s theoretical Friday game jam produced #FappyBird by @DagScheve: Keep that hand moving up and down the pipe at a controlled pace. (x)

So... it's a cannon-stroking simulator?


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