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Damien Question (Spoilers)

dream fall chapters book one Damian

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#41 deckarde

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 06:17

If I remember correctly, Liv sends you a text at the end of Dreamfall telling you that she "went underground". That may include faking her own death. Maybe.


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#42 DollyDagger

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 07:08

Or RTG might decide that would be far to obvious, and she could turn out to take her magic and go full on Klacks.

 

I hope not, and I don't expect that to happen, but at the same time if I were a mage, I would probably threaten to "Go Full Klacks" at least once a week. "You're not LISTENING to me! I swear, one of these days..."


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#43 Pawlo_86

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 09:30

If I remember correctly, Liv sends you a text at the end of Dreamfall telling you that she "went underground". That may include faking her own death. Maybe.

 

Olivia was in real trouble in Dreamfall. She hacked into EYE's system. Also it seems that WATIcorp decided to kill all people who knew about Dreamer/Alchera. I think that Liv was killed by WATI.



#44 Jecica

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 13:08

I refuse to acknowledge Liv was killed! Uh-uh, no way. I hope she used her awesome skills to fake her death and vanish. Regarding Damien, I believe his whole story is fishy, and I hope Zoe wakes up and realises this.


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#45 wandrew

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 13:22

I think I secretly wished Liv dead (and possibly publicly), but now I feel a little responsible. :)


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#46 CosmicD

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 13:52

If I remember correctly, Liv sends you a text at the end of Dreamfall telling you that she "went underground". That may include faking her own death. Maybe.

And it's coming from ANON.EUROPOLIS.shenanigans network thingy , :) So before book 1 was out, I had this theory that this is why Zoë ends up in Europolis, although this can still be quite true in some form... if "faith brings you where you're needed the most" is still a thing in chapters.



#47 khh

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 15:00

I think wati killed Damien and Liv, but why they didn't kill Zoe?

Zoë was in a deep coma destined to never wake up.  They just didn't account for the fact that she has super-powers.


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#48 Maum

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 15:40

I don't like the idea of main characters being killed off 'off camera'. I think it's a cop out, specially when fans have been invested in storylines and people.
I still refuse to believe either of them are dead.

 

Liv went underground.

As for Damien- Zoe never finished her sentence. Maybe he escaped and went cyber terrorist and is now the most wanted man in the world. ;)


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#49 Mr Moo

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 15:56

If Damien is still alive, he would have been in captivity when the recordings admitting his sole responsibility were made, or they would make no sense. At best he's escaped and still alive. Or he's still captive, or he's dead. Proof of death, or he's still possibly alive. ;)

 

Liv is pretty much the same, could be captive, escaped or dead. Proof of death, please, or she's still possibly alive. ;)



#50 Maum

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 16:06

I'm obviously way too soppy but I thought the relationship between Damien and Zoe was v sweet and well portrayed. I would have liked to see something more between the two of them. It's not often you see realistic relationship between characters in computer games.



#51 Vostrino

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Posted 25 October 2014 - 23:07

if DFC is targeted more to new players, damien might be dead because all the built up for their relationship is pertinent to having played dreamfall.

 

if DFC is targeted more towards the players of prev. games, im pretty sure we'll see damien again because dismissing him in one sentence after multiple years wait is so cruel.

 

i still can't make what RTG aims are for DFC. is it a direct continuation of dreamfall. (direct as in the original two-parter that could, and take DFC running full steam after book 1)

 

or RTG aims for DFC to be a complete standalone story in addition to being a wrap-up for dreamfall (which involves a lot more world-building and exposition dump for newer players)

 

like me (before i decided to start playing dreamfall, now at ch. 10). the POV you have from having played dreamfall and go blind playing DFC is completely different.

 

idk how many ppl invested enough on TLJ saga to create an account here after just playing DFC, but i was one of them. i finished book 1 before ever touching dreamfall. and dreamfall so far, ch. 10 has gave me a new appreciation of what book 1 was all about.

 

so... as for damien, if the game designed to pander to new audiences we probably won't see much of damien anymore other than some exposition here and there. same with liv.

 

though for dreamfall players, olivia seems real and cool enough for wanting to see more of her. so there's that



#52 Layara

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Posted 26 October 2014 - 00:50

Damien's chances of survival seem extremely slim to me. WATI needed a scapegoat, someone or something they could blame the static on. And Ragnar mentioned quite a while ago that Damien would be talked about in DFC, but not make an appearance, so it looks like he's gone for good.

 

Olivia, on the other hand, I'm not so sure about. She managed to go into hiding before the end of Dreamfall, and maybe the EYE was never able to find her. Telling Zoe that Liv died would be the easiest way to keep her from looking for her old friend. Or Liv faked that accident herself, to throw the EYE off. Or maybe I'm just not ready to accept that she's dead. :blush:


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#53 Fantasysci5

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 04:04

I'm just reminded of in TLJ, when we only hear a small bit about Tobias' death...I miss Tobias. <3

 

I love the "go full Klacks". It needs to be a thing. XD


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#54 magritte

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 21:15

Damien is pretty definitely dead in my opinion.  WATI may have even faked his suicide and left a "confessional letter".  Reza (or some simulation thereof) alive was useful to them because he could write an "expose" fingering Damien after they manipulated his memories and/or provided him with false evidence.  There's no advantage to WATI in keeping him alive and because he worked there it would have been very easy for them to get hold of him.

 

As to Zoe, she was supposed to remain in a coma, so WATI is watching her via Falk, the bug in the apartment and probably the psychiatrist in case she starts remembering anything dangerous to them.  

 

Olivia might be alive.  She would have been targeted by WATI too, but...she was clever, so you never know.



#55 Kari2

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 23:39

Keep in mind that WATI knows:

That Zoe's dreams can not be read and are different than "dreamers"

That Zoe had a connection with Faith and helped her move on - freeing the Wire

 

WATI probably recognizes but does not understand Zoe's abilities, and will not kill her for that reason.

WATI also does not know how much Zoe really knows about the dreamer.

 

Damien and Liv would be viewed as enemies.


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#56 LizzieDream9

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 22:45

One quick question that I haven't seen raised yet; How would WATI know about Olivia? The EYE may have been looking for her because she hacked into their network for a quick chat but would they know what she said during the phonecall? I would think Liv would know how to encrypt it. I can't remember exactly what was said during the conversation, only that it happened before Zoe met Damien. Would it have been incriminating enough for the EYE to know to tell WATI about her? Depending on what happened to Reza, they might have known she was "possibly" involved (since Reza told Zoe to get her help with his journal) which may have been enough but I'm not so sure. Zoe was the only one in direct contact with Olivia and the Dreamer couldn't read Zoe's mind so I'm not really sure if they would have known to have Liv killed if she actually is dead. Did I miss something?

 

As for Damien... I pretty much assumed he had been caught and/or killed when he didn't show up to meet Zoe in Russia during the original game. I actually was a bit puzzled by their relationship. Zoe was under a lot of stress and it just seemed to happen a little too fast for it to have been "real". Although waking up from a coma and moving in with your ex-boyfriend right away isn't exactly taking it slow either. I'm thinking she's just impulsive. I'm hoping that actually works out for her at some point.


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#57 Ringtail

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 00:48

On Liv - she was publicly a friend of Zoe's.  Even if the EYE didn't turn info on Liv's hacking of their network over to Wati (which, since the EYE are basically corporate police, they would probably have done), she's a "known associate" - so if/when they started looking in to Zoe's personal life, they would have turned up Liv.  And Liv's store.  And Reza's encrypted notebook on Liv's store's computer. (I think I remember Liv doing the decryption on her work computer - but I'm not 100% sure of that.)

 

Plus, I'd agree with Kari2's thoughts above -- if part of Wati's plan is to keep Zoe under observation, but disconnect from her support network (and, possibly, her memories), then they have a vested interest in wiping out her close friends. 



#58 LizzieDream9

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 01:20

On Liv - she was publicly a friend of Zoe's.  Even if the EYE didn't turn info on Liv's hacking of their network over to Wati (which, since the EYE are basically corporate police, they would probably have done), she's a "known associate" - so if/when they started looking in to Zoe's personal life, they would have turned up Liv.  And Liv's store.  And Reza's encrypted notebook on Liv's store's computer. (I think I remember Liv doing the decryption on her work computer - but I'm not 100% sure of that.)

 

Plus, I'd agree with Kari2's thoughts above -- if part of Wati's plan is to keep Zoe under observation, but disconnect from her support network (and, possibly, her memories), then they have a vested interest in wiping out her close friends. 

 

True but didn't Zoe say in her journal in DLC if you chose "the path that was" something about her two friends at Cape Town University? They were the two that sent her emails in the previous game. I guess WATI could have decided they weren't close enough to Zoe to be killed. I don't know; I can't remember exactly what was said. I'll look again later tonight. I wouldn't think Liv would be stupid enough to use her work computer or leave anything behind in her store related to what was going on before she went underground like she said in her message. She seemed to know the stakes far more so than Zoe did. Since she's a professional hacker, I'd think WATI would have had to have gotten really lucky in order to track her down. I need to do another playthrough of both games; I have so many questions now. 

 

I'm sure we'll find out Liv's fate for certain in the future Books but... yeah, I want to know now.  :) If she is alive and we get to see her in the game, I sure hope they get the same voice actress as before. Liv's voice was just so fun and upbeat even when things got bad. It was great to lighten the mood. Things really went down after she stopped calling. 

 

Just had a second thought; if Olivia is alive then she probably knows or has an idea that Zoe is being watched by WATI or someone so it would be very risky for them to attempt to contact each other. That said, maybe Liv did try and that's how she got caught. Now my head is going in circles.

 

Hope more theories pop up either way. It's fun to speculate and read others' speculations. I've come across several bits of information I had previously missed during my own playthroughs. I think it's a testament to how great this story is that we can't quite figure out exactly what's going on. I just hope the ending is as great. I don't want a repeat of the Mass Effect 3 letdown. :(


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#59 Ringtail

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 01:33

Yeah, as I was typing my reply above, I thought about Kat and what's-his-name too. Also Zoe's dad. I guess I'd reconcile those by believing that (1) Zoe dropped out of college months earlier, so her college buddies were low-risk to Wati's plans, and (2) something's up with Gabriel and his mysterious work detail in Bombay (which I think we might learn more about eventually).

For me personally, I wouldn't mind if Liv didn't appear in Chapters. I didn't particularly care for the character.

#60 LizzieDream9

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 01:40

Yeah, I've noticed she seems to be "love her or hate her" type character. To each their own. :)

 

I agree that something is definitely up with Gabriel in Bombay. First I thought she said he was in her hospital room every day to visit but then she tells the shrink that he rented out the house and moved to Bombay as if he had done so abruptly and without talking to her about it first. Maybe that ties in with Kari2 said in that he is also a target of WATI to keep Zoe in the dark. They wouldn't have to kill him, just threaten him to get out of the way or else harm could come to Zoe. I'd believe he would more than willingly do whatever it took to keep her safe.


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