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#61 Ringtail

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 16:01

Well, we do have Kian Alvane running around in DFC, so any interaction with Lady Alvane might take place between him & her.
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#62 Bruno

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 16:01

April had a confusing childhood. We know this already. :P
 
Though that would only be if April is in fact Lady Alvane. 
 
I'm honestly just throwing things out there since we seem to be careening into a Whovian level family tree time paradox thing. 
 
In all honesty, though I really didn't think that we'd fine out much new about Lady Alvane in Chapters. I sort of assumed that since the mystery was introduced in TLJ, it would be wrapped up in TLJH. It still might. But indications seem to be that the HoAW won't just make a token appearance in the game, but be somewhat important. I'm sort of inclined to agree about the title screen being there. It does have a similar feel to it.

 
Wait... what if... EVERY character was April Ryan?! Well, everyone except Crow, of course, who was actually dreaming the whole thing from the start!! We even had this tip from Crow himself:

Oh. (yawned) I was having this weird dream about a big-ass turkey wearing a pair of red shoes... and you were there, and he was there, and... and ... maybe it wasn't a dream after all?


Oooohh... I think I'm on to something here...

 

 

(sorry, I'm up since 4am, I'll be quiet now...  :unsure: )


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#63 agirlnamedbob

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 16:12

 
Wait... what if... EVERY character was April Ryan?! Well, everyone except Crow, of course, who was actually dreaming the whole thing from the start!! We even had this tip from Crow himself:


Oooohh... I think I'm on to something here...

 

 

(sorry, I'm up since 4am, I'll be quiet now...  :unsure: )

 

Someone alert Ragnar. Someone else clearly hacked into RTG's internal wiki. 

 

 

Well, we do have Kian Alvane running around in DFC, so any interaction with Lady Alvane might take place between him & her.

 

This did cross my mind. There HAS to be some connection between the pair of them. I don't know why else they would have the same surname. 

 

If Zoe's sort of narrating her own story at the start, then perhaps the HoAW serves as a framing element for Kian's story. If he does shift (and I really hope he does) maybe he shifts there rather than immediately to Stark?

 

Alternately, and possibly more likely, the HoAW could be the framing element for mysterious playable character the third. 

 

Or, you know, a combination of those elements, since in theory PC3 will weave into both Zoe and Kian's stories. 


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#64 thelj

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 17:00

I was browsing the thirteenchapters forum the other day and i saw this Ragnar tweet (from December 2012) for the first time:   

 

Will we find out the identity of the 3 people talking in front of the fireplace at the very beginning of #TLJ?

Sort of.

 

So,we will get at least some sort of explanation about LA.(unless the other 2 young people are somehow important and the "sort of" refers to them,but i find that unlikely.)


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#65 Vainamoinen

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 18:51

Finding out about Lady Aprilane, all right... but, ermmm, the Bavarians? Are they really meant to be important?
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#66 Pawlo_86

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Posted 03 September 2014 - 18:57

Ragnar and Dag said that Lady Alvane mystery is much complicated so it must be something more than only April = Lady Alvane.



#67 Vainamoinen

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 09:38

In all honesty, though I really didn't think that we'd fine out much new about Lady Alvane in Chapters. I sort of assumed that since the mystery was introduced in TLJ, it would be wrapped up in TLJH. It still might. But indications seem to be that the HoAW won't just make a token appearance in the game, but be somewhat important. I'm sort of inclined to agree about the title screen being there. It does have a similar feel to it.


A "token appearance" would not be satisfying. The HoaW was a separate Kickstarter stretch goal and advertised to be "part of the game's frontend". At the time, I already consider it a given that the entire menu of Chapters is HoaW themed, and submenus to look different than the main menu in that respect.

As for the Alvane/Ryan revelation time frame, yes of course that "mystery" is THE thing RTG can save for The Longest Journey Home. My last posts made clear that I don't really consider it that much of a mystery - because I in fact like the closure of TLJ to be revelatory in nature already. I could even imagine that the ending of TLJH would mirror TLJ's ending and April=Alvane to never ever be super mega definitely be confirmed (Old Crow: "Lady April Alvane! Yes, you with the glasses who formerly went by the name of Ryan and saved and destroyed the balance, I am talking to you!").

If you went into Dreamfall knowing that "April will become Lady Alvane", you of course got teased when she met someone of that name. But apart from this, Dreamfall wasn't really about that somewhat artificial "Alvane mystery". April's story arc in the Dreamer Cycle is "who is this April person now, how did she abandon Crow, why has she become a terrorist", "what robbed her of being special", "how will she get her powers back", "in what way has Zoë saved April" and of course: "How did April survive her fall in Khazad-dûm, err, I mean, Swamp City"? Those are the immediate, clearly Dreamer Cycle questions which do need an answer in Chapters.

As to the last question: Remember how in TLJ, when April thought that there's no way out, she somehow ended up in the House of all Worlds? Maybe that's literally her "safe place". ;)
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#68 Bruno

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 10:10

Maybe this is a good time and place to remember this blog post from Ragnar's old blog back in 2003, which refers to the Lady Alvane Mystery:

 

 

 

And now for something completely different: Someone pointed out to me that in the German version ofThe Longest Journey - and this is all serious geek-speak reserved for the TLJ players out there, by the way - Lady Alvane, the old woman who appears at the beginning and end of the story, refers to herself as "April Ryan".

Well. Since I didn't personally do the translation or, as a matter of fact, ever play the German version of the game (my German is about as good as my Spanish: not very), I cannot verify the information. But I do know that in my version of the story - the original English one (which I obviously consider canon) - the Lady Alvane never calls herself April, and the whole question of her identity was intentionally and deliberately left unanswered. Translated interpretations aside, there are only two people who know the truth. And we're not telling. Yet.

Because it'll all be revealed eventually. When we say so.

Oh, and by the way, for those of you who wonder: I believe that time-travel is often a cheap and dirty solution to a difficult problem - a deus ex machina - and while I'm not saying there isn't time-travel in the TLJ universe; if it is, it certainly won't be cheap & dirty. And Lady Alvane's encounter with April Ryan halfway through the story isn't necessarily what it appears to be. Threads are intertwined not just across worlds, but across the ages; beginnings are sometimes endings; there are places where time does not move in a straight line - where time is irrelevant - and those places are closer than we think; and yes, this is all painfully obtuse, but, hey!, it's my journal. I get to do whatever I want to do.

Without revealing any great secrets - it's way too early for that - the TLJ saga is most definitely heading towards a grand conclusion...involving, amongst other grand and epic revelations, the Truth about Lady Alvane (which the Germans aren't privy to).

But that won't happen in the next game, because the next game is just part two, so you'll have to stay patient and stick with me. There are miles to walk yet. 

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#69 Vainamoinen

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 10:17

...I've been pointing out in various places throughout the forums these last two years that it isn't true. To my knowledge, Crow does NOT refer to Lady Alvane as April in the German version.

(And while we're at it, judging from the recent Gamescom interviews, I think Ragnar continuously misinterprets a quote made by Steven Spielberg concerning the relationship of controller and heart).

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#70 Pawlo_86

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 10:49

Lady Alvane knows April's fate - her present and her future ("the pain will be with you to the rest of your life"). Ragnar hinted that LA isn't April. It must be someone else. We must wait and see how Zoe's journey will end in Dreamfall Chapters and what will happen with Kian ALVANE.

 

Lady Alvane: How strange to remember April Ryan. It was long, long time ago. Now MY time is also coming to end...

 

It all hints that Lady Alvane knew April Ryan in the past and HOAW scene is set in distant future from TLJ.



#71 Vainamoinen

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 11:05

Ragnar hinted that LA isn't April. It must be someone else.


Exactly that is the conclusion Ragnar's post above DOESN'T want you to make. ;)

 

the whole question of her identity was intentionally and deliberately left unanswered


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#72 WorldsReunited

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 11:07

I for one am very much looking forward to returning to the House of all Worlds. I am kinda expecting it to be in the interludes, but I might be wrong. Either way, it's an intruiging place. I also hope that DF:C (and I am sure it will) touches on the importance of Kian in the saga. His role in Dreamfall was not as big as I would've liked it to be and I am not sure where he is in the big picture.

 

Also I still believe that the House of all Worlds is in the Storytime. Or related to the Storytime.



#73 toremygg

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 11:24

Also I still believe that the House of all Worlds is in the Storytime. Or related to the Storytime.

Or is what's left of the Storytime after the Reunification? Or is the Guardian's realm after Reunification? The possibilities are probably fairly many. ;)



#74 Lee-m

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 11:26

Or is what's left of the Storytime after the Reunification? Or is the Guardian's realm after Reunification? The possibilities are probably fairly many. ;)

I think the storytime exists divide or no divide. It is possible that creating the divide changed it in some way.

#75 Vainamoinen

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 11:41

The Divide can't pierce the Storytime, the Storytime is the only place the Guardian can't reach or look into, and the Storytime feeds both worlds with reality. That might be the reason why Halloway doesn't know what's going on. Stark has found a way to get into the Storytime, so technology oozes from Stark via Storytime into Arcadia. The Guardian's influence has been circumvented.

The House of all Worlds then is everything all at once and nothing at all. It obviously exists in the future – the unified future in which the Balance is a thing of the past. The dangers that threaten all the other worlds do not threaten the HoaW. As such, it is the ultimate safe house from the currents of space and time, from the Divide, from the Storytime.

Possibly. ;)
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#76 Dmm

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 12:13

What I find interesting is that the Lady Alvane appears to be the same age when telling the story of April Ryan and the Balance to the two young people in the HoAW and when she encounters April, suggesting that the HoAW is not only outside of space but also time; it is sort of a timeless place. Lady Alvane and Crow continue to age while residing in the HoAW but can open a door for people from any world and from any time. I also believe that people who enter the HoAW can only return to the time in which they live, they cannot time travel and neither can Lady Alvane.

 

Also I thought this part of the conversation was expressed in a rather unusual way:

 

April: Did you bring me here?

Old Woman: You brought yourself here, but yes, I opened a doorway for you.

 

I felt that April was simply looking for a way to escape and at first thought she had opened a portal in order to shift. When she sensed it wasn't an actual shifting portal she naturally ask the question, Did you bring me here?

Lady Alvane could have said, No, but I opened a doorway for you so you could escape your enemy. Her using the expression "You brought yourself here" suggested to me that Lady Alvane was saying I brought my former self as April here to the HoAW.


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#77 spyked

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 13:31

The House of all Worlds then is everything all at once and nothing at all. It obviously exists in the future – the unified future in which the Balance is a thing of the past. The dangers that threaten all the other worlds do not threaten the HoaW. As such, it is the ultimate safe house from the currents of space and time, from the Divide, from the Storytime.

Possibly. ;)

 

For some reason, the HoAW reminds me of the Worlds' End Inn from Neil Gaiman's Sandman. If I remember right, Ragnar is a fan of Neil Gaiman, although the Storytime would be more like the equivalent of the Dreaming (the Sandman's realm).

 

So yeah, I'm guessing that the HoAW is somehow a timeless place.



#78 Vainamoinen

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 14:07

As long as it's not the Restaurant at the End of the Universe... ;)


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#79 agirlnamedbob

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 15:54

A "token appearance" would not be satisfying. The HoaW was a separate Kickstarter stretch goal and advertised to be "part of the game's frontend". At the time, I already consider it a given that the entire menu of Chapters is HoaW themed, and submenus to look different than the main menu in that respect.

 

I think my phrasing here was perhaps poor. What I more meant was that since it was a stretch goal, it is presumably therefore not part of what the team had whittled down into the "core" of the game. 

 

Still, even hitting the stretch goal and allowing it to be a bigger part of the game, my assumption was that it was going to offer some cool tidbits, but not be totally integral to the core story. It's possible that since that stretch goal was met, however, things have since changed in that regard. Or not. 

 

Guess we'll find out. 


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#80 Bruno

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 16:53

I think my phrasing here was perhaps poor. What I more meant was that since it was a stretch goal, it is presumably therefore not part of what the team had whittled down into the "core" of the game. 

 

It might have been part of the core story all along, but not necessarily as an explorable location, which, IIRC, was what the stretch goal was about. It could have been planned as part of the interludes, for instance, or in scenes where key information would be given even if there was no player control of a playable character... if this makes any sense!...


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