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#1 Abnax

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Posted 03 August 2016 - 23:04

I've recently been contacting Ragnar cause I read "There won't be The Longest Journey Home" he had been talking about.

 

I'll just copy/paste it, and hope you'll help me change his mind about that, really..

 

 

 

Dear Ragnar,

I will maybe be a bit aggressive during my post, I'm sorry for that in advance.
I shouldn't, really, but TLJ is in my heart for ages.
So I'll first start with a: very nice job for that story, it is (was!?) clearly awesome !

But (the part I hate)...
The story isn't finished at all and I just heard you wouldn't make TLJH !?


First of all, why ?
I heard about money problem ... but you don't need ANY !!
Not to mention you wanted to do a 3D game (which cost so much more money and time) while you had a perfect 2D gameplay.
If you get back to 2D gameplay (with please more items and puzzles than we had on Dreamfall), you would make the game in under 1 year with a great team !!

Second, how ?
How can you let a story like that without an end ?
How can you let your fans disappointed that way ?
I don't get it, really. Is money your goal ? With such a story, it can't be, otherwise you're just an impostor !
Tell us please your point of view.

To finish, and that's the most important part, you're not alone man !
You have fans. Some are developpers, some are writers, some are drawers, some singers, some musicians !
Fucking ask them to HELP YOU doing what they all want to happen: a REAL The Longest Journey end ! And not a fan trade, neither a quick end, the REAL one. The one you though when you first started TLJ !
[...]


Just tell me why you don't want to end that game: All the reasons.
If there are real ones, then we'll understand.
But still, we want an end, give us scripts, the story, and we'll make the game for you.
But you cannot let such a thing unfinished ! (Except if you hadn't any story ending at first point and you're making fan trade/hole filling, in which case don't continue, tell it and stop, cause you would damage a great start)

Anyway, after that heavy shout - sorry about that tho, my heart is speaking -, I once again congrats you for the game and hope you'll provide us all the reasons.
Or for the best, change your mind.

I wish you successful continuation,

Abnax'

 

PS: If you think this post his dumb and useless, just delete it.

But please, for TLJ saga, think of a solution to bring an end to it !



#2 MadJock

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Posted 03 August 2016 - 23:54

1. Rights to TLJ and characters owned by Funcom, so they need to be on board or atleast greenlight it.

2. Not many Devs go straight into a follow up/sequel after wrapping on a game. (Which they still haven't as yet, as they're working on physical copies and PS4 version too) Due to being drained or tired of the world, but also monetary reasons.
(Taking a break from it is a good thing)

3. Bottom line is they want to make games and specifically the games they want to make! Let them spread their wings and try something new, it'll benefit TLJH if they come back to it in the future.

4. Not sure why you're demanding answers really, if you love the team and the games they make then just accept their decision.
When Naughty Dog decided to do the last of us instead of another Uncharted, people called them crazy. But look what they created!! So hold back and give them room to grow as creators and enjoy whatever they may bring. ;)
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#3 bongboy

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 00:32

You should know that Ragnar doesn't appear to read PMs sent to him on this board. He will probably read this thread, though.



#4 Ringtail

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 01:18

I totally agree with MadJock's comments above.  If you love somebody, set them free, and all that.  And Ragnar's given some insights about the reasons for their decision on TLJH - look up his posts from June 11-13 (excerpts below).  I suspect you're not going to get more of an explanation than this.

 

"TLJH was supposed to take place after the end of TLJ, and before Dreamfall, but with bits and pieces taking place both before AND after that.

 

It's complicated, since it was designed to cover a lot of events over a lot of years, tying up some of the loose threads that are still left hanging — even after the end of Chapters.

 

The outline of the story exists, and I might share it with you guys some day…

 

[...]we're not 'bored' with the 'franchise' — not at all. We dearly love this saga, and our fans, and wrapping up Chapters has been an emotional experience for all of us. It's satisfying but heartbreaking, and part of me would love to jump right into TLJH to tell a personal and soulful story about a character I care deeply about…but for many, many reasons I don't think it will happen.

 

[...] Nothing has been abandoned, no one gave up, the story has not been left unfinished. TLJH was a possibility for another story in the same universe, one that explores what happened to April Ryan, but it has little to do with the story we're telling (and finishing) now.

 

[...]My point is: don't think the story is incomplete without TLJH, or that you'll need that mythical game in order to get closure or understand the overarching story. You don't. Our story's been fully told, and come Friday, we're done (ish; we still have the short stories and comics to come, of course). The dream of TLJH was to take one last, nostalgic journey together with April Ryan (and Crow) to fill in some of the blanks and answer a few more questions…but maybe it's better to leave it be.

 

After all, mystery is important."


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#5 Abnax

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 12:41

 

The outline of the story exists, and I might share it with you guys some day

If he chooses anyway not to continue TLJ, I really hope he will... It's so bad to leave a story without any end..
It's like being in a plane for a journey and being stuck in the air, without never seeing the final destination..

 

 

part of me would love to jump right into TLJH to tell a personal and soulful story about a character I care deeply about…but for many, many reasons I don't think it will happen.

If he'd love to, than what can prevent it to happen ?

Every problem has a solution: except if he has a disease or something and prefer living than giving an end to what he started.

 

 

Nothing has been abandoned, no one gave up, the story has not been left unfinished

Hu ? There are many spots unresolved:

Spoiler

I mean, all we have is suspicions, we're sure of nothing: will we have the correct answers someday from the creator ?

 

 

 

1. Rights to TLJ and characters owned by Funcom, so they need to be on board or atleast greenlight it.

I don't mind, I can give them the full rights of the made game if they want.
And I guess earning money without spending 1 dollar if fine to them.

 

 

3. Bottom line is they want to make games and specifically the games they want to make! Let them spread their wings and try something new, it'll benefit TLJH if they come back to it in the future.

True ... if they come back to it someday.. :/

 

 

Not sure why you're demanding answers really, if you love the team and the games they make then just accept their decision.

I'm asking for reasons so I can find a solution so both makers and fans are happy..

 

 

When Naughty Dog decided to do the last of us instead of another Uncharted, people called them crazy. But look what they created!! So hold back and give them room to grow as creators and enjoy whatever they may bring.

Uncharted isn't linked between eachothers ?
I've been playing 2 and 3, and I felt like 2 different stories link between eachothers to make a sense. Total hole filling to me.

And didn't they make a 4th ? Won't they make a 5th ? They can make and stop whenever they want, there is no story line.

Plus Naughty Dog never made a follow of Jak & Daxter: the story was over.

They made another game called Jak II (and not Jak & Daxter II cause it's a totally different game) in the same universe. But I'm sure this game was never meant to be in the first place.

 

There on TLJ/Dreamfall, it speaks about the same story, the same conspiracy: it is the same game.
 

 

All I want is answers of some holes in the actual story. No interpretation free.

Comics can be fine if he does make it, but a TLJH would be just AWESOME.
One of the best end we could get.
Ragnar baited us so much with it on a Reddit post, he can't leave us like that. <.<

 

For real, I don't mind how he gives answers, I just want to know...



#6 Ringtail

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 15:34

If he'd love to, than what can prevent it to happen?

(...)
 
I'm asking for reasons so I can find a solution so both makers and fans are happy..

(...)

For real, I don't mind how he gives answers, I just want to know...


I understand your frustration, but I don't think you should expect more concrete reasons from RTG in the near future. (I could, of course, be wrong.) There are a lot of plausible reasons: the logistics of licensing intellectual property from Funcom, availability of a team to work on it, availability of voice actors, other projects in the pipeline, a desire to build out the company's portfolio of games, other things that aren't appropriate to talk about publicly. But I think "many, many reasons" is what Ragnar's comfortable saying, and we need to respect that.

I get it, I really do. I love this universe and these characters, and I would love to see the story continue, and get some answers about the Kin, etc. And I'm sure that if we don't get TLJH, we'll get some awesome fan-created works, like we did after TLJ (I still am a huge fan of Tullis' fanfics.) But I don't think that what you're proposing - pushing Ragnar to agree to a fan-sourced but "official" TLJH - is either feasible or appropriate to ask for. I think we need to respect their judgement.

But if they get to a place where they want to pursue TLJH, I will totally be there. :)
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#7 magic88889

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 09:50

This is what, the fifth time this has come up?  I keep thinking that Ragnar is cursing the day he decided to make this a stretch goal in the kickstarter.

 

Ragnar's made it clear that if it's going to happen, it won't happen now, and it might never happen.  I'm sure his reasons are solid, and if there was a way he'd be exploring it.  There are very few game developers that I trust, and Ragnar is one of them, so when he says that he has good reasons for not doing it, I'm going to trust him.

 

Plus, and I've said this before, I'm not sure we really need the game.  Are there things to clear up? Sure.  But the way that Chapters ended wrapped up almost all of the major plotlines, answered most of the big questions, and did it in a way that feels extremely satisfying.  To have it end where everything began was just about perfect.  Really, the only things we have left are a few things about specific characters and specific moments that are mostly tangential to the overall plot.

 

Would I love more TLJ, of course!  But I don't want Ragnar to feel rushed, or forced to do so. 


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#8 Abnax

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 10:27

Would I love more TLJ, of course!  But I don't want Ragnar to feel rushed, or forced to do so. 

Me neither, but he said he'd love to do it ... so I guess we can find a solution (if we know the problems).
But nevermind, you don't seem to get the point.


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#9 bongboy

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 11:48

Me neither, but he said he'd love to do it ... so I guess we can find a solution (if we know the problems).
But nevermind, you don't seem to get the point.

Exactly. Ragnar feels/thinks he can't do it now, possibly not ever, and I don't blame him for not revealing the reasons... not right now, at least. On the other hand, I'm personally sick and tired of people pretending that there aren't a ton of major plotlines in TLJ, Dreamfall and also Dreamfall Chapters that were never tied up in any way, shape or form. Ragnar told us that there will be some things about April's journey that he wanted to explain, but the main plot points of the games, especially the dreamer cycle, will be tied up in book five, and that we should wait to play it before assuming what will or won't be tied up. This was all well and good and all until we played book five and yet after putting our heads together, we still don't understand what happened. There are still a metric fuckton of plotlines that were never tied up and there were also a ton of times that we were told "the balance has shifted" only to find out that all that happened was a slightly different line of dialogue, if even that. We really need to figure out everything that was not explained in any way and put it together in a concise list and politely ask that Ragnar and Dag seriously consider explaining at least a few of the many, many, many things that were left unanswered. It would be fine if they answer them here on the forums, but it would obviously be better if they were to answer them in one or more of the following: The complete edition, the novels/short stories/books in the enclave, and at the very least a skeletal outline of TLJH. I'm not asking for every single detail to be spelled out to me; I'm asking for a TON of major plot points to not be abandoned, therefore ruining the entire franchise.

 

What's up with Cortez? Did he intend for Brian to be possessed by the undreaming, and did he intend for his possession to result in the genocide of the magicals, or was that simply an unintended consequence of Brian traveling to storytime?

 

The white of the kin died and her daughter was born, then her daughter was murdered and yet her spirit lived on to speak to Saga. Did this happen with any of the other kin? The red and green of the kin appeared to have died, but we don't know that for sure; all we know is that they disappeared and April's watch stopped ticking. What happened to the blue of the kin? Was he Uncle Galath?

 

What happened to Benrime, Fiona, Mickey, Emma and Charlie?

 

What happened to Samantha Gilmore and the twins? They were never mentioned again. Alvin Peats was mentioned again, but only in an extremely cryptic manner, and only if he was the Alvin who's mentioned when you repeatedly click the teacup at the end of DFC, but is there anything more at all that can be revealed about him? Who was Queenie? Why was Mr. London introduced as at least a supporting character and then completely written off? What was the point of this? Major plotlines from TLJ and Dreamfall could have been explained in any way, shape or form, but instead time was wasted with a lot of stuff like Mr. London, who shows up in DFC, seems like he might actually be at least a supporting character at some point, and then disappears with no explanation as to why he was ever even introduced in the first place.

 

How did Zoe save April? She didn't. Zoe saw April die. At that point April died and was gone forever. You can give me this BS about reincarnation all you want, but Saga clearly is her own person, and therefore she's not April. So how was April saved, and from what was she saved? Herself? Her suicidal tendencies? This seems like a major cop-out. Zoe was supposed to save April, but failed, so April is gone forever... but Saga somehow has some of her memories when she's a child, but when she's old she still doesn't understand the connection she shares with April... but still, somehow either Zoe saved April, as the "white lady" said, even though she wasn't saved; she was brutally murdered and then kinda sorta reborn as a character who is a textbook case of a deus ex machina, or she wasn't saved at all, which actually makes sense, but it also makes a liar out of the "white lady", whom I assume is the ghost of the white kin reborn. Also, when Zoe became "the dreamer", she could have just dreamed April back into being, but she didn't. This really makes it seem like Ragnar and Dag twisted the knife after having stabbed April in the heart. Why? How could anyone hate April Ryan at all, let alone hate her enough to completely fuck her over again and again and again? You're a couple of cold-hearted bastards and I'm really glad that I don't know you on a personal level. If that's what you would do to a good person, what would you do to a person who's not really good or bad but somewhere in-between? Yikes.

 

I'm not asking for the world. I'm not asking for everything to be explained. I'm just asking for the saga to not be left almost completely unexplained. We hardcore fans have had quite a go at trying to figure out any and all of the points I just brought up, and then some, but we can't, and I really don't think that's because it's possible to figure them out with the information we have in front of us, but we've been unable to do so. I really think it's because we don't have the information in front of us that we need to be able to figure them out. I'd love to be wrong, although that would make us less clever than I think we are, but I really don't think I am. I know I've been harsh here, but I really think that at some point someone needs to say these things, explain why they're saying them and expect to be taken seriously. I'm sorry for irritating the fanboys/fangirls, but I really think that what I've said was well-reasoned, well thought out and valid. If you can answer any of my questions, please do so. If you can't, please understand why a good number of fans of the saga feel as though the saga deserves better than to be left with a ton of unanswered questions. And to Ragnar and Dag, I love you both to death, no matter what happens. Please try to understand what I mean and where I'm coming from. Please tell us what we're missing. Do it in whatever way you feel appropriate, but for the love of the balance, do it! I'll be the first to thank you. And either way, I thank you from the bottom of my heart for having brought us this wonderful, beautiful saga. I know you're supposed to always leave them wanting more, but you should know that there's a limit to that.


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#10 magic88889

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 21:03

Me neither, but he said he'd love to do it ... so I guess we can find a solution (if we know the problems).
But nevermind, you don't seem to get the point.

 

No, I do get it.  I had much the same reaction when I first heard the news.  I couldn't believe it.  It was such a blow, as many of us were hoping to have one more game to tie up the loose ends.  One more game with April! 

 

And whether or not he wants to do it is besides the point.  He's stated that he can't, for various reasons.  I'm sure part of that is time and money, but there are likely many other reasons as well.  We've had some speculation in the past about what those might be, but Ragnar's not talking.  Whatever the reasons, he doesn't deserve to have us constantly bug him about the game.  They're not even done with this game yet, and they have  two  more unfinished games that have been announced.  How would you feel if you mentioned a project one time, decided later that it wouldn't work, and then have random people you never met constantly nag you about it saying you should do it?

 

I get the passion, I really do.  But do you think that Ragnar does not share that passion?  That if there was any way, he wouldn't be making the game? 



#11 bongboy

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 22:39

At this point, I think it would be prudent to suggest that a mod move this thread here or here, due to the spoilers that have already been mentioned and the potential spoilers to come. If I were to put spoiler tags in my previous post, I'd basically have to make the entire post a spoiler, and when I think about the nature of the thread, I really think it belongs in a place where spoilers are allowed.



#12 khh

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 08:24

I agree. I've moved it now.

April Ryan is my friend,
Every sorrow she can mend.
When I visit her dark realm,
Does it simply overwhelm.


#13 bongboy

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Posted 06 August 2016 - 08:26

I agree. I've moved it now.

Thank you. I appreciate it. :)



#14 Frungi

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 06:15

I heard about money problem ... but you don't need ANY !!
Not to mention you wanted to do a 3D game (which cost so much more money and time) while you had a perfect 2D gameplay.

 

I just want to say, and I’m surprised no one brought it up: quality 2D art—and in the quantity that would be needed—is neither cheap nor easy to produce. It can in fact be more demanding than 3D assets.






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