Jump to content


Photo

Book 1 and 2 story changes


  • Please log in to reply
25 replies to this topic

#1 Kari2

Kari2

    Vestrum Crier

  • Minstrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 910 posts
  • LocationSan Francisco Bay Area

Posted 30 June 2016 - 17:35

I have noticed some changes made to Book 1and 2. There are probably more that I haven't notices, but here they are.

 

Book 1: Zoe in Storytime

The first two encounters with dreamers have been replaced.

The wardrobe key has been eliminated from the Bedroom encounter.

 

Book 1: Zoe in Propast

The phrase "Hey,you" has been removed from Reza's greeting  when Zoe brings him lunch.

The third Kidbot puzzle has been eliminated and Mira talks to Zoe when Zoe finishes the second puzzle.

The Shitbot bot-to-bot test seems to have been streamlined - or, maybe I just played it differently.

 

Book 2: Kian in Marcuria

Piano practice can be heard coming from a house in The Bones while Kian is on his mission.


  • MisterMetropolis and Clairobscur like this

#2 VerticalBlank

VerticalBlank

    Rubber Ducky

  • Vestrum
  • Pip
  • 9 posts

Posted 02 July 2016 - 00:04

Yup. Dumbing down beacuse we can't possibly have challenging gameplay: it might put people off and then where would we be? Sheesh.

By the same way of thinking book 4 became a railroad and book 5 a cutscene-o-rama with only a few brief interruptions from the WASD keys.


  • charmed23 and Nathanael like this

#3 MisterMetropolis

MisterMetropolis

    Vestrum Crier

  • Drachkin
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 508 posts

Posted 02 July 2016 - 00:19

I don't think the intention was to dumb down gameplay or to underestimate users. After all, this is a sequel to The Longest Journey, maybe one of the hardest (if only for its epic length, but still) adventure games out there. I think the changes were made to more accurately reflect how RTG sees the story now that the whole game has been made, and to make the dialogue flow as a more complete story without any plotholes or loose ends left. For instance, in Chapter 1, the way they have it now is more the way they envisioned Zoe spending her days helping people instead of going into each dream individually like they had originally designed.


"But even if we don't reach that lofty goal this time around, we hope to some day still be able to tell this story. April's story, all of it. All that remains of it. Because it needs to be told. And you all deserve to hear it. And we would love to share it with you." - RTG, March 1, 2013

 

"Even if we don't get to $2 million, we will still look into ways of making The Longest Journey Home a reality...some day. It's a story we all want to tell, and we won't let it die.- RTG, March 9, 2013


#4 yodagreen3

yodagreen3

    Vestrum Crier

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 749 posts

Posted 02 July 2016 - 04:07

In terms of gameplay this is not a sequel to the TLJ ... :D It is what it is... It's a sequel but not really comparable to the other two games as far as game play goes.

Ragnar said this was a choice driven game, the emphasis was never put on puzzles. 



#5 Vainamoinen

Vainamoinen

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Vestrum
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6154 posts

Posted 02 July 2016 - 08:21

Ragnar said this was a choice driven game, the emphasis was never put on puzzles.


Ooookay, let's not falsify history here. :P

I've read ex-Telltale marketer Emily Morganti's adventuregamers Chapters review this morning. She's giving the whole game 2.5 stars out of 5. For a website ostensibly promoting adventure games, that is a really, really harsh verdict, and I had a much more profound experience with the game than Emily did, but I concede I see most of her points in principle.

Challenge, in Chapters, is usually "find the hotspot", and of some of the precious few instances where something a little more creative was asked of the player have now been cut out of Book One. At the same time, RTG is kind of obliged to put even more find the hotspot type "puzzles" into Chapters because of the Loremaster stretch goal.

 

No, sir, those are definitely not the challenging puzzles the Kickstarter promised. And as to the plot based choices (first introduced as the core game mechanic in a wam-bam-WTF way at rezzed 2013 and never mentioned during the Kickstarter), there were practically none relevant in both Books 4 and 5. It just was a game mechanic once introduced, then mostly forgotten. :mellow:

 

I had an incredible time walking through the streets of Propast and Marcuria, particularly Propast when listening in to conversations, but even this comparatively strong pillar of interactivity crumbled by the mid point of the game. The Riverwood hub, major Kickstarter selling point, ended up on the cutting room floor. I love a lot of Chapters' story – opposed to e.g. Emily – but the interactive concepts, each of them, never really took off.


  • MisterMetropolis, bongboy, Jelena and 8 others like this

Hey Ubisoft, you can keep your "seamless vast online GTA in space" to yourselves. Signed, one of the greatest Beyond Good & Evil fans alive.


#6 bongboy

bongboy

    Vestrum Herald

  • Banned
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1710 posts
  • LocationRenton, WA, USA

Posted 02 July 2016 - 09:39

Ooookay, let's not falsify history here. :P

I've read ex-Telltale marketer Emily Morganti's adventuregamers Chapters review this morning. She's giving the whole game 2.5 stars out of 5. For a website ostensibly promoting adventure games, that is a really, really harsh verdict, and I had a much more profound experience with the game than Emily did, but I concede I see most of her points in principle.

Challenge, in Chapters, is usually "find the hotspot", and of some of the precious few instances where something a little more creative was asked of the player have now been cut out of Book One. At the same time, RTG is kind of obliged to put even more find the hotspot type "puzzles" into Chapters because of the Loremaster stretch goal.

 

No, sir, those are definitely not the challenging puzzles the Kickstarter promised. And as to the plot based choices (first introduced as the core game mechanic in a wam-bam-WTF way at rezzed 2013 and never mentioned during the Kickstarter), there were practically none relevant in both Books 4 and 5. It just was a game mechanic once introduced, then mostly forgotten. :mellow:

 

I had an incredible time walking through the streets of Propast and Marcuria, particularly Propast when listening in to conversations, but even this comparatively strong pillar of interactivity crumbled by the mid point of the game. The Riverwood hub, major Kickstarter selling point, ended up on the cutting room floor. I love a lot of Chapters' story – opposed to e.g. Emily – but the interactive concepts, each of them, never really took off.

Everything you just said is true, but let's keep in mind that many kickstarter goals are yet to be fulfilled, and it's entirely possible that RTG reduced the amount of "frustrating hotspots and puzzles" for the release of book 5 because it was the point that a lot of players/potential players were waiting for before starting playing. Now that this hurdle has been jumped, there's clearly a lot that's upcoming for the "complete edition", which will clearly be for the hardcore fans, and will include the tome of the balance, the enclave library, etc. It's entirely possible that RTG made the early versions of the game for the hardcore fans, temporarily modified it for the johnny-come-latelys, and will adjust it far back in our favor for the "complete edition", or whatever Ragnar's decided to call it. I really think that this is the most likely assumption, seeing as how so much was adjusted in favor of casual fans for book 5, while there is still a ton of content left that's not yet been produced, let alone released, that is obviously geared towards hardcore fans, that's been promised for the "complete edition", because we hardcore fans met said goals. Well after the johnny-come-latelys have played the version that was slightly dumbed down for them, the full, complete, originally-intended edition will be released for those of us who went way out of our way to make sure it would happen, and we will forever cherish it. Let's look at the big picture, and let's hope that it ends up with the "true fan" edition, or at least an option to choose between what you would expect to be presented with if you were a true fan or a johnny-come-lately. Maybe the shooter equivalent of easy or hard. :)


  • Jelena, NeilClaimer and Starseeker like this

#7 Sarah_Stark

Sarah_Stark

    Arcadia Native

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 184 posts
  • LocationEngland

Posted 02 July 2016 - 13:58

I hope that this isn't considered the version for 'Johhny come-lately' because the whole 'mystery' of who the Prophet was meant far less to them than the rest of us. In fact, were this the cut-down, streamlined story, he should have been revealed in the first book as I've argued elsewhere. The mystery was intriguing to explore, but only because it allowed us to basically imagine we didn't know and come out with crazy ideas.

It kept us talking about it though, and I guess the issue would have been if we'd known sooner, there'd have been greater pressure on making that reveal more relevant, with background and depth added to it that wasn't within the very same book as the reveal.

 

I also can't help but hope that an extended version isn't filled with puzzles because by-and-large that'll be all that'd be added. They're padding, even in games where they're a pervasive mechanic. The same way the endless corridors in a shooter are. More is almost always less when it comes to a mechanic and the risk of over-use. The story is the meat of the experience, in my view.

 

The way the choices were was never something that really felt like the 'hook' for the game, despite the emphasis put on 'The Balance Has Shifted'. The game's an interactive story, with little-to-no branching. This is probably true of most games labelled as 'Adventure' or 'Point and Click' of course. Certainly however, it stands out more in a game that suggests choice, but only offers an illusion.


I could of course be very wrong.


#8 Jelena

Jelena

    Arcadia Native

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 270 posts
  • LocationKosovska Mitrovica, Kosovo/Serbia

Posted 03 July 2016 - 14:13

Everything you just said is true, but let's keep in mind that many kickstarter goals are yet to be fulfilled, and it's entirely possible that RTG reduced the amount of "frustrating hotspots and puzzles" for the release of book 5 because it was the point that a lot of players/potential players were waiting for before starting playing. Now that this hurdle has been jumped, there's clearly a lot that's upcoming for the "complete edition", which will clearly be for the hardcore fans, and will include the tome of the balance, the enclave library, etc. It's entirely possible that RTG made the early versions of the game for the hardcore fans, temporarily modified it for the johnny-come-latelys, and will adjust it far back in our favor for the "complete edition", or whatever Ragnar's decided to call it. I really think that this is the most likely assumption, seeing as how so much was adjusted in favor of casual fans for book 5, while there is still a ton of content left that's not yet been produced, let alone released, that is obviously geared towards hardcore fans, that's been promised for the "complete edition", because we hardcore fans met said goals. Well after the johnny-come-latelys have played the version that was slightly dumbed down for them, the full, complete, originally-intended edition will be released for those of us who went way out of our way to make sure it would happen, and we will forever cherish it. Let's look at the big picture, and let's hope that it ends up with the "true fan" edition, or at least an option to choose between what you would expect to be presented with if you were a true fan or a johnny-come-lately. Maybe the shooter equivalent of easy or hard. :)

 

When is this "complete edition" gonna happen?? :)



#9 Vainamoinen

Vainamoinen

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Vestrum
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6154 posts

Posted 03 July 2016 - 14:38

When is this "complete edition" gonna happen?? :)

 

Think 2017 and hope for a pleasant surprise. :)


  • MisterMetropolis, bongboy, Jelena and 2 others like this

Hey Ubisoft, you can keep your "seamless vast online GTA in space" to yourselves. Signed, one of the greatest Beyond Good & Evil fans alive.


#10 Kari2

Kari2

    Vestrum Crier

  • Minstrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 910 posts
  • LocationSan Francisco Bay Area

Posted 04 July 2016 - 17:42

Another Book 1 addition I forgot to mention was that on the top floor of the Keep, Kian is beset with arrows while he accomplishes his tasks. The piano practice is also in Book 1.



#11 Valiah

Valiah

    Arcadia Native

  • Drachkin
  • PipPipPip
  • 162 posts
  • LocationPortland, OR

Posted 17 July 2016 - 03:26

Another book 1 change - When you meet Baruti you used to have two choices - one about the feed, and the other on whether you promise to join him at a party or not. After the patch there are no choices. 


WARNING: This post may contain opinions, and they might not be yours


#12 Kari2

Kari2

    Vestrum Crier

  • Minstrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 910 posts
  • LocationSan Francisco Bay Area

Posted 17 July 2016 - 16:45

There is also a change in Book 4. Originally the four dancers in the Marcuria square danced in unity. now each pair dances separately.


  • Vainamoinen likes this

#13 Lee-m

Lee-m

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Vestrum
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1857 posts
  • LocationYorkshire, England

Posted 17 July 2016 - 18:26

As far as I can tell, from what has been posted, all the changes are directly down to pacing. To play the whole game as it was (not just one book at a time with a break between) would have been too slow. The things that have been cut were obviously deemed pointless at this stage.



#14 Future Markus

Future Markus

    Arcadia Native

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPip
  • 122 posts

Posted 19 July 2016 - 07:53

Book 2: Kian in Marcuria

Piano practice can be heard coming from a house in The Bones while Kian is on his mission.

 

I noticed that too! There are also some houses in Book 4 from which you hear a Recorder being played, which I thought was weird.

 

Folks, we have a new set of mystery doors on our hands...


  • Vainamoinen, NeilClaimer and Kari2 like this

#15 Ringtail

Ringtail

    Vestrum Herald

  • Drachkin
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1319 posts
  • LocationRockville, MD, USA

Posted 20 July 2016 - 17:42

I noticed that too! There are also some houses in Book 4 from which you hear a Recorder being played, which I thought was weird.

 

Folks, we have a new set of mystery doors on our hands...

 

Hmmm...I don't want to blow this out of proportion, but I wonder if the piano and recorder are the start of getting back to a very old promise.  Waaaay back, when the fan music competition fell apart, there was some talk about the game eventually having the capacity to play fan-created music (like the tracks that folks in the community compiled into the "unofficial album").  It seems like locations in Marcuria that play incidental music could be good candidates for places where fan-created tracks could be modded in.


  • Vainamoinen, NeilClaimer, Bruno and 2 others like this

#16 Kari2

Kari2

    Vestrum Crier

  • Minstrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 910 posts
  • LocationSan Francisco Bay Area

Posted 20 July 2016 - 19:45

I noticed that too! There are also some houses in Book 4 from which you hear a Recorder being played, which I thought was weird.

 

Folks, we have a new set of mystery doors on our hands...

 

I had Zoe search all over Marcuria for the recorder sounds, but could not find any. At one point Crow found Zoe and asked if she were sightseeing. Crow also said that this wasn't adventure and that he was bored.



#17 Pekka

Pekka

    Arcadia Native

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPip
  • 160 posts
  • LocationFinland

Posted 20 July 2016 - 20:03

The only puzzle in DFC that put a stop to my progress for an annoyingly long period of time was the Great Drawing (Pixel) Hunt in Book 3. And that was nothing compared to some of the truly interesting ones in TLJ. :D

 

Hopefully the Ultimate GOTY Edition will contain all scenes that have been either removed since first release or didn't make it to the game at all.


"An nescis, mi fili, quantilla prudentia mundus regatur."

 

- Axel Oxenstierna (1583 - 1654)


#18 Future Markus

Future Markus

    Arcadia Native

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPip
  • 122 posts

Posted 21 July 2016 - 04:26

I had Zoe search all over Marcuria for the recorder sounds, but could not find any. At one point Crow found Zoe and asked if she were sightseeing. Crow also said that this wasn't adventure and that he was bored.


The one I remember is the one that's immediately east of the southernmost pipe network access point. This house:

Spoiler

 
That's obviously not B4. Let me check and get back to you.
  • Kari2 likes this

#19 Kari2

Kari2

    Vestrum Crier

  • Minstrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 910 posts
  • LocationSan Francisco Bay Area

Posted 21 July 2016 - 21:58

The one I remember is the one that's immediately east of the southernmost pipe network access point. This house:


 
That's obviously not B4. Let me check and get back to you.

 

I restored Book 3 in version 5.0.3.X and heard a viola playing at that location.



#20 Future Markus

Future Markus

    Arcadia Native

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPip
  • 122 posts

Posted 24 July 2016 - 08:15

I restored Book 3 in version 5.0.3.X and heard a viola playing at that location.

 

Okay so I did a bunch of snooping. So, there's the piano house which you noted (actually I think it's a harp... hard to tell) and the viola house you found. Both seemingly appear in every scene in books 2, 3, and 4 (in the same places).

 

The recorder houses (there are two) only appear in book 5, in the scene where Kian has to free Crow.

 

My search wasn't completely exhaustive. There may be another mystery house out there...

I made some recordings, if anyone wants to listen and help identify the instruments; I'm not the best judge of what is what. :-)

Attached Files


  • Kari2 likes this




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users