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Was Reza effectively brainwashed?

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#1 sokol64

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:08

So, Reza was brainwashed by WATICorp to work for them.

But - in my game he fled to Iceland with explosive documents from Zoë due to EYE raid in The Hand's office. In the end, all was published by The Hand.

My question is obvious: why he didn't give these info to WATICorp during Iceland stay or earlier? I really expect that.


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#2 Pawlo_86

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:13

It seems that Reza was brainwashed untill prototype Eingana was destroyed. This happend between removing of Faith and release of Dreamer. So Reza who went to hospital room was saved.

#3 sokol64

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:21

Dunno, mate. I think he was free after last Eingana was destroyed.

 

I think Reza's brainwash was quite a mistake. Sounds really cliffhanging in the end of D:TLJ, but needless in DFC.



#4 Indrid Cold

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:21

It seems that Reza was brainwashed untill prototype Eingana was destroyed. This happend between removing of Faith and release of Dreamer. So Reza who went to hospital room was saved.

No. Chang said in Book 5 that she's going to "fix" Reza once she's done with Zoë.


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#5 Pawlo_86

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:29

Dunno, mate. I think he was free after last Eingana was destroyed.
 
I think Reza's brainwash was quite a mistake. Sounds really cliffhanging in the end of D:TLJ, but needless in DFC.


But it has a sense in terms of story in Dreamfall. Reza was fooled with his big story. He was captured in Newport and connected to Dreamer. WATI used him to spy Zoe. So if he wasn't free untill destruction of Eingana 2 then this perfectly explain "Carefull dad.That's not him".

#6 sokol64

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 07:55

But it has a sense in terms of story in Dreamfall. Reza was fooled with his big story. He was captured in Newport and connected to Dreamer. WATI used him to spy Zoe. So if he wasn't free untill destruction of Eingana 2 then this perfectly explain "Carefull dad.That's not him".

Make sense, you're right. But look at DFC story, there was no place for some development of this part. It was played down, but still need to solve.


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#7 Pawlo_86

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 08:04

Make sense, you're right. But look at DFC story, there was no place for some development of this part. It was played down, but still need to solve.


I never trusted him in DFC. Mostly because what happend in Dreamfall and Zoe never asked him about it.

#8 Lee-m

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 09:23

The whole Reza thing was easily the poorest aspect of the game, in all aspects.
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#9 Pawlo_86

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 09:35

The whole Reza thing was easily the poorest aspect of the game, in all aspects.


I agree. We did search him in half of Dreamfall and in Chapters...viola Reza is already in Propast. Och and he was brainwashed by WATI. Rushed resolution.
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#10 Sarah_Stark

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 10:51

And in all of that she lost a better match in Damien, to boot! Honestly, the Reza tracking in Dreamfall was so much a part of the story, that for it all to be resolved the way it was is kinda maddening. Sure, he was more a McGuffin in the sense that he just acts as an excuse for Zoe to start her journey, but alongside his 'brainwashing' not being explained fully, there's also the fact that in Dreamfall, there's more than one hint he's actually been dead for a while. When she's on his trail, there are signs of a struggle, and blood in one location, and near the end Peats states he's dead. I think it honestly would have been a better ending for him. It explained Zoe's comment at the end of the game, and him being alive in Chapters always just jarred. In part because of everything mentioned.

 

Ignoring the fact that RTG decided he's not dead afterall, I agree that the brainwashing was somewhat... Odd. It'd have made more sense to have him solely stick to stories where he could affect nothing at all or else start a different job so he's more effective in keeping an eye on Zoe. Not to mention the fact that she dreamed herself to Propast and into a life with Reza. I'm not entirely sure how that happened.

 

What I mean by that is: I get that Zoe projected herself into Propast, and it sounds like all of it was a defence mechanism. But in turn she fabricated this new life, including with Reza. There doesn't seem to be an explanation for how or why her imagining this was supported by Helena with a brainwashed Reza. As I say, he was more or less thought dead. Then he's back after the infamous ''That's not Reza'' then suddenly he's alive and well, and living with her, and yet there's no sense of connection.

 

Did Zoe dream herself into Propast, and they then sent the brainwashed Reza to keep her in this delusion, or was he always there and she somehow knew and dreamed herself to his side?

 

I just can't find a way to make them being together at the start of the game make sense when to all intents and purposes Zoe just 'blinked' herself into Propast or somewhere else. Though the game only suggests she appeared in Europolis with the coma, the beginning of the game has her seeing herself in a hospital bed with Reza watching over her. How does that fit into it all? Was it because of that incorrect image she had of her situation that they were able to send Reza to her? Where exactly was she when she woke up, as surely the hospital staff would have been unwilling to release a person they had no record of admitting? Or did she stagger her projection and that's why her initial moments when 'awake' are so staggered?

 

And still I come back to 'That's not Reza.' Gaaaaah!


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I could of course be very wrong.


#11 the red of the kin

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 11:36

I think Reza was definitely brainwashed and in the end we see him with that expression like "oh my god look what I got us into"...so even if it lacks more visual and verbal explanation (him talking), it satisfies me.


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#12 Mr Moo

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 17:23

No. Chang said in Book 5 that she's going to "fix" Reza once she's done with Zoë.

 

I wouldn't trust anything Chang says. I assumed she would kill Reza and Gabriel while Zoe is busy with Eingana. And Zoe would never survive the ordeal Chang planned for her.


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#13 Kari2

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 19:23

I've always believed that Reza would come around. Brainwashing does not necessarily mean that he was made into a spy. It could simply mean that Reza's memories regarding his investigations into Wati were erased. He would still care about and have feelings for Zoe. Morpheus' disgusting description of what happened to Reza could simple have been a way to strike out at Zoe. Nothing more may have happened to Reza than having certain memories erased. I also think that Reza would have wanted to join Zoe in Propast, and may not have known that the Propast Zoe was a projection. Helena would simple have had to tell Reza that Zoe awoke and is in Propast. Reza's support was very important to Zoe.


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#14 Vainamoinen

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 20:01

No. Chang said in Book 5 that she's going to "fix" Reza once she's done with Zoë.

 

She also wanted to fix Stark. One wonders how she would have 'improved' Reza.


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#15 Kari2

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 20:25

She also wanted to fix Stark. One wonders how she would have 'improved' Reza.

I don't understand how Brian and Helena could think that they could "reboot" the world without rebooting the Dream and ending themselves in the process.



#16 Pawlo_86

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 20:29

I don't understand how Brian and Helena could think that they could "reboot" the world without rebooting the Dream and ending themselves in the process.


Undreaming poisoned their minds. Played them well. Final dialog of Prophet hints this. I just don't understand why Brian helped Zoe to reach Purple Mountains and save Lux.
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#17 Lee-m

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 20:39

I just don't understand why Brian helped Zoe to reach Purple Mountains and save Lux.

Hes still brian the explorer some times. Plus he gave the undreaming to Klacks. At least in part?



#18 magritte

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 21:55

Undreaming poisoned their minds. Played them well. Final dialog of Prophet hints this. I just don't understand why Brian helped Zoe to reach Purple Mountains and save Lux.

Saving Lux doesn't interfere with his plans.  There's no point in uniting the realms if both realms are doomed to extinction.  Also, Zoe has to master her dreaming powers in order to be able to reshape the realms for Helena Chang.


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