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Book Five - Burst out your feelings

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#41 OptoNick


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Posted 18 June 2016 - 12:52

Just finished, smitten with awe and nostalgic sadness. That was a hell of the Journey.


Not in the mood for lengthy posts with praises, nitpicking and deep thoughts about story just now, second playthrough from save with other choices is calling.




Can't wait for novels and ultimate edition of DFC, will start whole TLJ/DF saga from scratch once again.

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#42 thelj


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Posted 18 June 2016 - 16:36

Cutscenes galore. Again.


Well, after Book 5 i don't find the whole plot of "Zoe was in a coma all this time" any less confusing or any more legit, but whatever, i was expecting that. No big deal.


In the previous books, i enjoyed all the parts related to the previous games just for the nostalgia factor. Now that the story is finished and it's clear that April: is dead and buried ( or rather, burned ), she's not even reborn as Saga and had nothing to do with the Dreamer plot, her presence in Book 5 almost pissed me off.

Really April? Zoe "freed" you"? Because last time i played DF, there was a raid and an Azadi asshole killed you, and Zoe had nothing to do with that.

The talisman of the Balance "mysteriously" appeared in THOAW?  :huh:

Saga got her hands on April's diary? Really??

What about the teensy prophecy: April will save the Balance, only to destroy it later? What happened to the second part? Did i miss something very obvious here?

The bottom line is: Zoe and Kian got their Disney ending, and April Ryan, the wonderful character that started the saga, after being used as a plot device, got a shitty ungraceful death and a few references/appearances here and there just for cheap feels. RIP April. You deserved better.


Talking about cheap feels, wtf was the "death" scene of Crow? Anybody who played the first game, knows Crow is alive and kicking in THOAW. Is Crow some type of Highlander or does Saga have resurrection powers? ( and what was that place that Crow and Zoe met and watched the memories? )


Yep, called it:

What if the Undreaming is like the Chaos vortex from TLJ? What if originally it was a part of Lux ( Dream-Undream, Balance and all that ) ? When it got separated from him/her, it became an evil entity that acts on it's own and Lux got sick. It somehow got stuck ( or someone trapped it there ) in Storytime and then it was unleashed into the world through Brian. 

Now someone ( Zoe? ) has to fuse it with Lux again, so that Lux gets healthy and whole again and the world goes back to normal. It would also justify Cortez having a hand in the unleashing. Win win situation.  :D
I would like that scenario if, besides being so outlandish, it wasn't a repeat of the Chaos vortex-Gordon-April story.


Also guessed, although i was totally joking when i first mentioned it, that the third character is L.Alvane. After we met Saga i was pretty convinced that she's the reborn April and thought: what do you know? we're actully playing as L.Alvane in a way ( because i always thought that April is L.Alvane ). To actually play as L.Alvane herself in her granny form, well...i didn't see that one coming. ( i tried the L-Shift out of curiosity and it didn't work. Being old sucks.  :lol:  )


Why do people say that Saga is Queenie? Queenie is Rose ( when you examine the teacup, Saga says: what happened to her dragonflies? ). They must be friends and either Queenie has also "mysterious" powers ( she knows all that stuff about Zoe, Hanna being special etc ) or Saga told her about Zoe etc.


Random thoughts:

- So, who was Faith's White Lady?

- Was Helena in cahoots with Brian? How? Confused about that.

- I agree with someone who said that Hami becoming buddies with the resistance people was rather rushed, and Anna ( though i never cared for her ) stabbing Vamon was rather satisfying. She got her revenge.

- After repeatedly getting the "Kian is gay" info throughout the game, we get an option to "kiss the girl"? Seriously?  :rolleyes:

- Kian drinking the bird bath water was pretty funny.

- 5 years later, Saga poses as princess Alvane but still wears the same Stark clothes.  :lol:

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#43 Toffy


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Posted 18 June 2016 - 17:32

Well, this is it.


I have very seperated feelings. Mostly I feel pleased and excited; I enjoyed the last chapter greatly. However, the amount of uncertainties and questions piling up is... disturbing.


I cried my eyes out on almost every encounter of April. Seeing her in this dreamy state, talking to her, and then finally seeing her in the House of all Worlds... It made my heart beat faster. I am always touchy feely about stories, touching upon their beginning and this is just the example. I understand that April is not reborn as Saga and if it is truly so, then I'm glad and relieved. I think that THIS is where April got her proper end, in my opinion. Beautiful and dramatic and well deserved. Though it pains me that her story seems faded, in the background of bigger plots. I still think it was amazing though.


Now, yay, Brian is the Prophet. BUT. It's like... it makes no sense whatsoever? A villain for the sake of villain? Brian, what was the point of any of it? I am so confused. He did seem shifty in DF:TLJ, but not at all so in TLJ. I don't know. I am not sure I am buying his Prophet story.


Okay, here comes the screaming. I CAN'T BELIEVE HE DID IT TO CROW. NO.


As for Zoe, ah, I feel really happy with the ending she got. I loved her conversation with Gabriel and it felt so heart warming, the way he spoke to her and how sincerely he cared for her. The woman calling herself Zoe's mother, however, is an insane delusioned scientist. Good riddance, lady, good riddance.


Loved Kian's story, though it seemed a bit foggy to me. Not even to say much here?


Well, for the end... Saga. I am confused. Utterly. Who is she? Who is this someone who tells her where to be and what to do? And really, she is Lady Alvane? I would buy it, but not by the way it was presented. It's ridiculous, all the "princess" thing and all. It's like the game designers didn't even bother to make up an explanation, a proper story?

I won't be throwing stones at RTG, but this just sounds like lazy writing to me. Or throwing a fishing rod for future projects?


Still not convinced.


Anyway, overall I absolutely loved the game! In general and by each book, and the last book for sure. The graphics are the most beautiful I've ever seen, music is amazing (was so happy to hear "Rush" again!), story writing was gripping and making one think. Thank you for the amazing hard work you've put in it. I had my share of tears while playing as well as laughter and thoughtfullness. Thank you for all this. And I hope this is not the last we see of this story :)

#44 Elssy


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 00:24

My eyes got wet a few times - first when Wonkers started to speak like him old self; but shed more tears at the end, when as Lady Alvane I was walking around the room and clicked every picture and item there.
When I clicked on the typing machine and Saga's parents photo it was realy heartbreaking what she said...


Btw I wonder what happened to her father, where did he go?


It's also interesting that Stark and Arcadia connected after all.



Another thing - we've met Faith, Zoe and Hanna, but what about Hope? 
I think the book five is quite good ending and summary but as I expected it didn't answer all questions, and there are so many of them.
It was quite obvious since the original Dreamfall that Brian Westhouse is connected with the Undreaming, and Book 5 gives a lot of time to explain it, showing as "plot twist" when in fact it wasn't a twist at all. They could have spent this time to show us what Saga told to Kian on the way to Sadir or tell more about Saga herself, her role seems to be very complicated but the game give a very little info about her.
But no more complaints, I'm sure everyone would want this book to be longer. I wish it wasn't the last one :(



( I hope someone in my country finaly going to release this game with the proper translations...english is not my first language and I didn't understand every word in the game, only most of it )

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#45 mallard


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 02:13

Sorry to be "That guy" potentially.   While sure this was an emotional ending, to say it was a satisfying ending is not true.


Think about it for a second once the emotional fog lifted from your head.


Things we still don't know:


What happened to April Ryan.  -  She said she's reborn, yet is walking with a possibly dead crow.   

Who Saga is - We crawled around and did these cut scenes as a baby to have no idea who she is, they released no information about her.  She is only useful as a deus ex machina.  On top of that the developers are actually mocking us as fans, having her tell Kian "Everything".

Crow? Alive? Dead? - We see crow die, then we see crow in the dreaming whatever talking to Zoe. Then we see him going off to the beyond with a possibly dead april.  Except whoops saga saves him , so then he's a small bird, then he's in the house of all worlds.

Drain-kin - Weren't they interesting?  I thought so.  Oh well.

Songlines? - WTF?  


Think of it like a puzzle, without sides.  Sure, its okay to not have defined edges, not everything needs fit together, it can be rough and mysterious.   Thats not what this is, this is someone throwing an all blue 1000 piece puzzle on the floor and saying , "Look isn't that pretty?, I wonder what it is, its mysterious...".

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#46 Bluejay


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 03:26

April Ryan and crow - not satisfying. I can't figure what they are. Dead? Alive? Were the both of them reborn; Saga, Crow? What?? Where did they walk off to? To be reborn and cycle around the same thing? Awful.

Saga and crow - missing chunks of Saga's development. How she knew what to do etc. Sure she said it all happened in the stories. Where did she read them? How did she find out? Songlines?


Zoe - good ending. good for her.

Kian - good ending. good for him. Wonder how he dealt with his mom. 


Bad guys mostly all died. Good riddance. 

Faith Manages - Delenn / Babylon 5

"Throw it and you're bedroom shoes!" - Honor Harrington to Nimitz

Dester'edre shena Tale'sedrin

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#47 agirlnamedbob


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 05:05

I've been thinking about it with the emotions mostly subsided and I'm still good with most of it. *shrug* Though while I was playing I was definitely taking note of things I knew weren't going to sit well with people. 


Which is fine. I totally respect the opinions of those who disagree / didn't find this conclusion satisfying / have too many questions still. 


I knew the Saga-ex-machina thing would bother people, but for me it mostly worked. *shrug* YMMV. 


Re: Songlines. I was a bit confused about this one...because it sounded familiar, but I couldn't place it. It's another reference to indigenous Australian mythos, like a lot of other things in Dreamfall. So for me, that fits. Could maybe be more explanation, but I also don't feel like it's 100% necessary. (Again. Totally fine with anyone who disagrees with me there.) And much of Saga's talk about all of that was a direct reference to what Lady Alvane told April in TLJ. So that connection helped (at least for me.) 


I'm fine with the vagueness of how some other things connect. In some places, I think I prefer it. Though there are a couple things I do wish they'd spelled out rather than left it open to interpretation, but not the same things that seem to be bugging a lot of people. :lol: 

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#48 virumor


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 05:18

I liked it despite the bad pacing and many loading screens.

#49 Pawlo_86


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 07:03

Finally the site is back so i can share my feelings. Book Five is EPIC! Fast and intense. No boring. It answers TONS of questions and left few nice mysteries. It is perfect ending of Dreamfall and great conclusion of The Longest Journey saga. I cried during and after Epilogue. Full circle.
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#50 Dreamcatcher


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 07:09

I´ve just finished my replay of all Books.

Book5 was a rollercoaster on a rocket sled.

I will need time to recover and let it sink in.

It kept every promise. Answers and a proper ending to Zoes story, but wow it was a hell of a ride.


There will be more stories from stark and Arcadia told in Games that are still to come!

It has been written. We can´t change that now.

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#51 jestas


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 07:27

Loved it. It was confusing, the plot was spelled out way too much, the bit about Ferdows and Wit cracking the vortex was evidently last minute rushed, but everything that didn't sit right with me was absolutely forgiven after that FANTASTIC epilogue.

I'll play it again with different choices, soon. Also looking forward to one or two Ragnar's books spinning off of this, and the complete physical version of the game I pledged for. And the soundtrack.

Heck, I may even buy the ps4 version when it comes out, just because. This story resonates with my life so much, it also encompassed almost half of it, from my first play of tlj to this day.

Thank you all.

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#52 magic88889


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 07:27

While there are certainly some feelings about this all being over, I am happy with how it ended.


I'm also happy that my theory about Dreamtime was spot on!  I'm a little miffed that they felt that they had to spell it out to me like I'm 5, but at least we know how Dreamtime relates to the Twin worlds, (and other worlds for that matter).  The one thing about my theory that wasn't made clear was Lux's nature.  Is he the only one?  Or does each world, each Dream have it's own First Dreamer.  I think it has to work that way, but it wasn't made clear.


Look at me, I'm complaining in one sentence about things being made too clear, and the next complaining how they aren't! :wacko:



Overall, the wrapped up the whole series nicely.  Did they answer every question and close every plot point? No.  But if this is the last game, I feel it is a fitting end to the series.  It wrapped up the biggest threads and answered the greatest questions.



Also, I played the new intro.  Fantastic!!! 

#53 ChrisR


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 07:57

At first I was like yay! Olivia's alive! And then I was like oh, damn, not really...
I was crying A LOT during the epilogue, it made me think about my life issues. Find April, save April was such a big deal, we deserved to know how Zoe "saved" her. Instead we got a short scene with April repeating what she already said in previous books - that she wanted to be reborn. It felt like a wasted opportunity for me - not letting April say something important, it was a really brief scene. Crow dying/staying alive was confusing.
Overall book 5 felt pretty epic, enjoyed it a lot.
Singing Crow<3 I thought setting man on fire was too cruel though.
Despite a number of unanswered questions I feel quite satisfied and think there's no real need in TLJH.
And yeah, Saga is definitely not Quinee. Queenie seems to be some mysterious Rose.

#54 Palinurus


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 08:50

Personally, I loved that while giving us some closure, they did not resolve all of the mysteries and did not tie up all of the lose threads.


The way I see it, the series has always been about stories, about how they always go on in one way or another, how they endlessly interweave with each other to form a tapestry that is too vast and rich for any single point of view to grasp completely. In that light, I think RTG did a great job in giving players the feeling of the characters having a story and a life beyond the scope of the game, of there being more to them than we can glimpse (which, also makes them appear that much more real and makes us care for them all the more). And I think we should be grateful for RTG for leaving all those blank spaces for us to fill and paint in the colours of our own imagination, and I'm quite confident that this alone will cause to the games to live on in the hearts of everyone for a very long time.

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#55 Clairobscur


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 09:12

The episode was epic and I enjoyed the ride. I had the same feeling as watching a galore of "Game of Thrones" episodes. As intense as it was, I had to stop at 2:20 am and go to sleep (which I could barely do).


There is still a lot to process but I am satisfied with the ending. We finally got answers to many questions and the most important to me: Zoë's got proper closure. Not the one I expected: I always thought (and wanted) her ending to be sad and tragic. I am glad I was wrong and that she got a happy ending. She deserved it. That final screen on the balcony in Casablanca will be a new wallpaper. :)


I am also glad that Kian's story got its closure and I would like to know more about him and Saga in Sadir.


On the other hand, I am not certain what to make of April-Crow-Saga dead-reborn-alive-whatever. So far, it is very confusing.


The Lux-Undreaming thing is also not clear.


I was a bit disappointed by how some choices played out like Falk Friedman, who is just mentioned in one sentence.


I was also happy that the performance was better on my system!


The more emotional moments for me were the Interlude with the empty and dreary HoAW, the final vision of Zoë in Casablanca and the Epilogue with old Saga and all the memories (especially Zoë's portrait, her parents, April and Crow).


Thank you RTG and Ragnar for this game and story, for your hard work and dedication! Thank you for the emotions, thank you for Zoë...

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#56 Pekka


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 09:28

I'm mostly happy with this final Book.


However, my biggest problem with Chapters was still there - the whole experience is more like an interactive movie, not a proper computer game. There was actually very little to do in this final Book. I was definitely well entertained for most of the time, but I was still hoping that I could actually play the game more than a few minutes between cutscenes.


They did a better job at tying up all the loose ends (and there were many of those!) than I had dared to hope, which is obviously great. Still, if this is really the last game ever to made in TLJ universe, they quite unfairly introduced several interesting new mysteries, most of them about Saga and her role in pretty much everything that has happened in the whole series.


The final scene in the House was absolutely brilliant. I can honestly say it was one of the best experiences I've ever had when playing computer games. :)


I seem to be at a loss of words for now. It's been a long journey from the late 1990s till today - and I mean that in every sense of the word journey.


I'm truly hoping there will be new games that take place in TLJ universe, even if they aren't about any of the characters that we've learned to know and love (and hate!) in the series. It's a fascinating fantasy world, and I'm sure there would be plenty of room for new stories to be told there.

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#57 Miral


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 09:37

Overall I loved Book Five, and DFC as a whole.  I would have liked it a bit better with a bit more gameplay (it was especially cutscene-heavy towards the end) but that wasn't really surprising.  The Prophet's identity and the reason he was doing it came as no surprise, although Klacks' involvement was unexpected.  The bit with Lux and the Undreaming (can we call it Nox now?) was also expected, but I think it worked out fairly well.


There was, of course, one particular moment that was entirely unexpected and just left me staring dumbfounded at the screen for a while.  I think you all know which one that was.  Still, I guess that turned out somewhat ok, given the epilogue.


I was still holding out some hope that April would make it back to be Lady Alvane, but that thread has been nipped off and tied up.  There's still a lot of mysteries behind Saga, though, and I hope we do get to hear her explanations to Kian in a future game.  (I know they said it was the end of the series, but that just means it's the end of April and Zoe's journeys -- we can still have another Saga [pun intended] later on.  I'm sure lots of people are ready to throw more money at RTG.  I can understand them wanting to take a break for a while though.)


There's quite a few fridge-logic-moments and threads left over, although for the number of loose ends prior to Book Five they did do an admirable job of tying most of them up, even if parts of it did feel a little like the corridor of memories from Life Is Strange (which is not a compliment).


I've been stubbornly resisting the urge to play through again and try the other paths until now, but I think it might finally be time.

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#58 Vainamoinen


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 09:44

I didn't cry (and I did cry at other points in Books past, especially when Sarah spoke), and I see a lot of scenes in a rather critical light (examples elsewhere), but after that last scene I entered a profound state of melancholy that I couldn't shake off for the entire rest of the day. It's what my BFF calls a "reality hangover": You immerse yourself so much in the fictional world that you're having a good bit of trouble getting back to an appropriate emotional state in the real one.


It_was_powerful. Really, really powerful, and it embodied The Longest Journey. :sotb:

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#59 Lee-m


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 11:15

...I entered a profound state of melancholy that I couldn't shake off for the entire rest of the day. It's what my BFF calls a "reality hangover": You immerse yourself so much in the fictional world that you're having a good bit of trouble getting back to an appropriate emotional state in the real one.

I have felt very similar. Plus this forum being all but down for the last 2 days really hasn't helped my mood lol.

I think the only things that are really bothering me at the end of that, was first, the total lack of any Kin related explanation. Given that they made a point of showing Cortez in the first game.

Didn't Queenie say she would see Zoe again before the end ? Same with the Vagabond really. That t-cup doesn't exactly help much.
and Reza... <shrug>. Just sort of shows up at the end...again...

And as in the original TLJ, April was the one who brought about reunification ? seems to be a big mis-step in story logic here. Cos shes gone.

I need to replay it, I was a fair few beers in by the end there, chances are I just missed some stuff.
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#60 M.Gson


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Posted 19 June 2016 - 11:23

Finished myself now... and oh boy...

I felt the book was very "Time to answer as much as possible and wrap things up" which was ok, because I - for one - want my answers :)

but at points in was too many answers to take in..


I actually thought I'd get through the book without tears - then Crow met April and they went on their journey together.. There was no stopping the emotions there.


and the epilogue with L.Alvane walking around the room - the voice, the nostalgia, Crow picking on the window - everything just made me cry... Reminded me and showed me how everything was connected with the previous game.


Time to try and get some sleep, this was amazing.

Thank you RTG!

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