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Time Full Circle - Revisiting Brian


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#1 Kari2

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 04:12

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If you need a distraction from the wait for Book 5, here are some thoughts regarding Brian.
 
 
 
Manny Chavez (Cortez) told Brian about Arcadia
 
Cortez directed Brian to the Monastary
 
The monks in the Monastery saw Brian as eager, open and perfect (a naivete)
 
The monks knew that he would release the Undreaming.  He was their last hope.
 
To escape the Undreaming, Brian had to enter into a horrific agreement
 
That agreement would provide an opportunity for (?) to enter the Worlds
 
Brian's union with (?) is parralleled by Zoe's unions with Lux and Yaga
 
It is unclear whether Brian will assist or obstruct Zoe.
 
Brian does not appear to be "The Wizard Of Lies", but was sent on a journey by Cortez and the Monks

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#2 the red of the kin

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 08:43

Ah! My good old friend Manny!

I was so shure Brian was the key to the undreaming. But it really seems it was Klacks.

 

I thought the full circle might refer to the cycle of the Balance but I'm surely wrong.

The fact that the monks were hoping to release the Undreaming underlines how they must have thought the undreaming is not a threat to their lives because who would be that insane (Zorg?).

 

Cortez worked for the balance. I think he 'was' truly a good 'person' and stayed true to this until the end. I'm quite sure that he had a good reason for setting in motion the whole deal with Brian.
I'm afraid I'll never get a clear answer to this, now that Klacks seems to be the prophet.


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IF YOU'RE A GHOST.......JUST LEAVE ME BE!


#3 Kari2

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 15:36

I still can't see Klacks as The Prophet. I think it is someone whom we have yet to meet or whom we least expect.



#4 toremygg

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 19:19

I still can't see Klacks as The Prophet. I think it is someone whom we have yet to meet or whom we least expect.

With you on the first part, but I fear we have to face reality. Or fiction, rather. The hints are too many to be red herrings.

#5 Kari2

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 21:16

With you on the first part, but I fear we have to face reality. Or fiction, rather. The hints are too many to be red herrings.

 

I guess we would first have to determined whether or not The Prophet and The Wizard Of Lies are one in the same of separate entities. I say 'entities' because we know that there are several other beings inside Klacks.



#6 Indrid Cold

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 21:34

I'm more curious about what "time is a circle" means than who the prophet is. Is there time travel, is there a Galactica-style "All of this has happened before and will happen again"?


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#7 Kari2

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 22:00

I'm more curious about what "time is a circle" means than who the prophet is. Is there time travel, is there a Galactica-style "All of this has happened before and will happen again"?

 

I agree. I took it as a variation on the expression "History repeats itself". My experience is that nothing ever happens twice and human history has been cyclical. Yes, history does repeat but never quite in the same way - after all it has been there and done that so why should it do it again.


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#8 Indrid Cold

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Posted 07 May 2016 - 22:33

I agree. I took it as a variation on the expression "History repeats itself". My experience is that nothing ever happens twice and human history has been cyclical. Yes, history does repeat but never quite in the same way - after all it has been there and done that so why should it do it again.

But even if that's all it means, how does it apply to this story? Has the Undreaming been unleashed before? Or maybe one of the Kin sent a non-shifter to the other world? Something else, I'd guess.



#9 Kari2

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 00:21

But even if that's all it means, how does it apply to this story? Has the Undreaming been unleashed before? Or maybe one of the Kin sent a non-shifter to the other world? Something else, I'd guess.

 The short response is that I don't know.  By sending Brian through a portal, they appear to be forcing a new cycle - but on what level? I guess we will just have to wait for Book 5.



#10 Vanya-illin

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 00:22

But even if that's all it means, how does it apply to this story? Has the Undreaming been unleashed before? Or maybe one of the Kin sent a non-shifter to the other world? Something else, I'd guess.

What comes to my mind is the catastrophe that necessitated the splitting of the world in the first place. If so, perhaps symmetry also demands the presence of the Undreaming for reunification.


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#11 toremygg

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 06:38

perhaps symmetry also demands the presence of the Undreaming for reunification.


This has always been my pet theory.

#12 Lee-m

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 12:58

My memory isnt the best, but I am sure in the long wait between games, we got told that the Prophet was someone we already knew up to and including the first Dreamfall. Also and that clues to the identity of the Prophet are in the original game. That never got elaborated on as far as I know.

So it shouldn't be a total unknown. If it is, there have been some changes since the first game.
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#13 Kari2

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 17:01

My memory isnt the best, but I am sure in the long wait between games, we got told that the Prophet was someone we already knew up to and including the first Dreamfall. Also and that clues to the identity of the Prophet are in the original game. That never got elaborated on as far as I know.

So it shouldn't be a total unknown. If it is, there have been some changes since the first game.

 

Adrian is still at the top of my list.  The Wizard Of Lies is someone else - maybe Klacks.  But then,  this game of who-is-who is like guessing the release date of Book 5.


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#14 Lee-m

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 17:45

I wouldn't have thought so personally. I doubt they would pick anyone out of the scope of the original Dreamfall game. Or it wouldnt make any sense to all the console folk who never played TLJ.
Chances are it is someone who hasnt shown up in the 2nd game yet.

As regards this time is a circle nonsense, its totally meaningless unless RTG actually add some context to it. Which I don't think they will.
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#15 Laura

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 21:34

I'm really hoping there will be a concrete resolution for Brian. I think he is too important to the series to leave as an open thread.



#16 magic88889

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 00:51

I thought the time is a circle thing was just a reference to how things have played out.  There was one world, it was split, and as some point it must be reunited.  I think that's all that means.

However, you can also draw some threads between the similarities on April and Zoe's stories, or perhaps April and Saga's similarities...

 

It works if you think about it for a bit.

 

 

As for Brian, I don't know.  I certainly feel that both he and Klacks have a larger role to play in the series, given how often they seem to pop up, but what that role is I don't know.  I'm not entirely convinced either of them is the Prophet. 


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#17 Kari2

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 18:48

 

 

As for Brian, I don't know.  I certainly feel that both he and Klacks have a larger role to play in the series, given how often they seem to pop up, but what that role is I don't know.  I'm not entirely convinced either of them is the Prophet. 

 

You know that Brian will be in Book 5 because of the Choices Zoe makes in Abnazus's Home.



#18 Kari2

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 07:47

What comes to my mind is the catastrophe that necessitated the splitting of the world in the first place. If so, perhaps symmetry also demands the presence of the Undreaming for reunification.

 

This has always been my pet theory.

 

There is some indirect support for this theory in Dreamfall

 

AIyb7d3.png

 

Each time I play through this section of Dreamfall, I am left with the same impression:
 
Brian has stayed behind in the library,
The White Dragon hears and sees him,
She asks if she can help him find something,
Brian morphs (out of our sight),
The Kin exclaims "No, What are you..."
The screen goes black and the flapping of wings can be heard.
Presumably the flapping of wings was the White Dragon flying off.
 
What is interesting is that the whole incident takes place infront of the Dark People. It is as though they are passive participents, much like the Tibetan Monks in Stark. Perhaps they mirror each other and can communicate with each other across The Divide. They may very well have welcomed the presence of the Undreaming.

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#19 bongboy

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 12:21

 

There is some indirect support for this theory in Dreamfall

 

AIyb7d3.png

 

Each time I play through this section of Dreamfall, I am left with the same impression:
 
Brian has stayed behind in the library,
The White Dragon hears and sees him,
She asks if she can help him find something,
Brian morphs (out of our sight),
The Kin exclaims "No, What are you..."
The screen goes black and the flapping of wings can be heard.
Presumably the flapping of wings was the White Dragon flying off.
 
What is interesting is that the whole incident takes place infront of the Dark People. It is as though they are passive participents, much like the Tibetan Monks in Stark. Perhaps they mirror each other and can communicate with each other across The Divide. They may very well have welcomed the presence of the Undreaming.

 

I always assumed the same thing, except that I assumed that the flapping wings were those of Crow, whom I assumed might have been possessed by the undreaming until he flew off, or, more likely, Brian assaulted her, at which point Crow flew off.


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#20 Lee-m

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 13:09

..or more likely, just like the Storm around the tower, the flapping was just put in for dramatic effect and can be dismissed in one sentence (like the storm). .

I would go with that.
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