52 replies to this topic

[Nancy Brown]

Guys, would be great to know your opinion on what Lux concept really is..

 

When I think of it, I am confused.. We know that Lux has dreamed everything and everything lives because Lux is dreaming...

 

1. But does this mean Lux dreamed not only the twin worlds but also other Galaxies? We know that, for example, Draic kin came from space... In this case, if Lux is ill, are there also problems with other worlds? Why it has to be twin worlds where Lux (or at least his projection) is located? What is happening with other worlds?

 

2. What power does Lux have? If he dreams everything why can't he simply undream the bad guys? What determines Lux's power limits? When I think of this, I suddenly think of Sims analogy... for example, the player is Lux in this case, he/she dreams what the Sims characters will say and do... however, if the player is sick and abandons the game for a while, the characters still continue to live their own life and do some things autonomously..things that the player might have even never wanted... (I think of old Sims version, i think i stopped paying on Sims 3 version )) Could it be what is also happening with Lux and Twin worlds? But in Sims, the player can return and fix everything - is this what Zoe is going to do?

 

 

[Mr_Russ]

Some answers fall out from the end of Book 4. Lux was ill. Zoe + Baba Yaga inside the Soul Stone + Lux have all merged to form one entity. Lux should now no longer be ill.

[Nancy Brown]

mmm... but this does not give answer to my questions, unfortunately....

[aeonfluxx75]

I'm having problems following since the whole Luxe & Baba insertion.  For what it's worth, most likely nothing, you're not alone.  I'm completely lost with the original world origin story we're told from TLJ - Kin and the splitting of the Earth I can't seem to make cohesive comprehension with DFC's Luxe, Baba and Zoe.  Maybe the Wiki could build those bridges, I haven't checked yet but I believe it's been updated recently.

[the red of the kin]

Guys, would be great to know your opinion on what Lux concept really is..

 

In general I guess the concept of Lux can be compared to the concept of Saga. They both create realities by narrating/drawing/dreaming them. ofcourse Lady Alvane comes to mind too.
We now know Lux was meant to unite with Zoe. Maybe she was sick because zoe was separated from her. I speculate Wati had something to do with it. I suspect Zoe was never born in the human way.

 

When I think of it, I am confused.. We know that Lux has dreamed everything and everything lives because Lux is dreaming...

 

I know: this is where we go metaphysical right? Silmarillion's similar. You have Eru which "thinks to life" all the gods and demigods (or whatever they are called). Then they all together begin the main song. Then after the song is done they sort of replay it while actually going into it.
This is where trying to find too many explanations might actually disrupt the poetical aspect of the myth. 

 

1. But does this mean Lux dreamed not only the twin worlds but also other Galaxies? We know that, for example, Draic kin came from space... In this case, if Lux is ill, are there also problems with other worlds? Why it has to be twin worlds where Lux (or at least his projection) is located? What is happening with other worlds?

 

I think Lux must have dreamt reality itself (let's leave the "who created the creator" question aside, shall we?). the Universe she dreamt must have multiple worlds since the house of all worlds would otherwise have a different name...like ...house of the twin worlds? 

Anyways Stark and Arcadia are to fuse again so...yeah...
We know there are other worlds (like Midgard, where Etta is from [if I recall it right]).

 

Lux might be located in Arcadia because that's where her "big bang" occurred. Zoe started from Stark instead (see my theory above). But Also the Oular and the Yethe were once a single people right? They divided at some point. So maybe Lux wasn't really in Arcadia before. Maybe she was somewhere else...somewhere in between.

 

2. What power does Lux have? If he dreams everything why can't he simply undream the bad guys? What determines Lux's power limits? When I think of this, I suddenly think of Sims analogy... for example, the player is Lux in this case, he/she dreams what the Sims characters will say and do... however, if the player is sick and abandons the game for a while, the characters still continue to live their own life and do some things autonomously..things that the player might have even never wanted... (I think of old Sims version, i think i stopped paying on Sims 3 version  )) Could it be what is also happening with Lux and Twin worlds? But in Sims, the player can return and fix everything - is this what Zoe is going to do?

 

This is the usual free will "debate" is the god self-limiting him/herself in order to give his/her creatures free will? What about the bad guys? Is a god morally right is he/she "lets the bad guys get away with it"? Why are there bad guys in the first place?

Well...

Let's say n my opinion Lux is not a real god in the sense we're used to. I think she (sorry: I don't believe in gods but if I did I'd sure hope it's a she since us males are full of shit) is more a "force of nature". It's a metaphisical force which doesn't have good or bad connotations. It's just does its thing. So no real limits in the way we conceive limits. 

[Nancy Brown]

Thank you, interesting to read!

 

On the worlds, I wonder, what is going on in the Draic Kin homeland, for example... If Lux is ill and someone is also killing their relatives (White of the Kin), why don't they come to Twin worlds to help? Or they lost connection completely because Lux is ill??? Questions, questions...

I hope RTG somehow beautifully link this Lux/Draic Kin concepts

 

On the power limitation yes, I agree, probably Lux just creates and maintaines the "ecosystem" while it then develops internally on its own...

[magic88889]

This is what I have gathered:

 

Lux is a Dreamer for the Universe we know as the Twin Worlds.  I would assume that would include other systems, galaxies, ect. that are in that universe.  Possibly including where the Kin come from.  It makes sense because in Stark they had started shipping people off the planet.

Now here's the thing, in aboriginal mythology, Dreamtime is the place all stories begin.  I believe that Storytime (the TLJ equivalent) is the birthplace of more than just this story.  I think that Lux is just one of a race of Dreamers, that all have Dreamed their own worlds. 

[Nancy Brown]

 I think that Lux is just one of a race of Dreamers, that all have Dreamed their own worlds. 

 

wow...

[agirlnamedbob]

I'm not necessarily sure about Lux being part of a race of Dreamers. 

 

I'm not going to totally rule it out, but we've kind of been hammering on the theme of "if Zoe and Kian don't do the thing, then this is the end of not just this world...but all worlds." 

 

And that was repeated in relation to Zoe and Lux. So...I kind of feel like maybe Lux (and now Zoe) is THE Dreamer, not A Dreamer. ...But again, I could be wrong. (This also potentially has some interesting implications as far as Zoe saving April if April has in fact been reborn as "The Girl Who Walks Between Worlds.") 

 

So...My personal take is that Lux is linked to more worlds. Though we don't know exactly what this even means. Are they complete and independent worlds? Are they more like alternate dimensions? Is the world of TLJ/DF some sort of central hub world with other worlds that are connected to it? 

 

I'm not sure what we'll get for answers as far as all of that is concerned, but I do expect that perhaps whatever happens with Saga and her most recent shift and the House of All Worlds may at least shed a sliver of light on this. 

 

As far as limitations to Lux's power... ...I mean. I feel like there's a point where some of that needs to be handwaved, the way one does with stories that involve deities or deity-like figures. We ask those questions all the time. Why doesn't the all powerful omnipotent figure just do whatever? Reasons™. 

 

I like some of the ideas presented with all of this, though I'm not sure how I feel about how it may complicate the TLJ Universe (...multiverse?). I'm reserving judgement there until after Book Five. 

[magritte]

As far as limitations to Lux's power... ...I mean. I feel like there's a point where some of that needs to be handwaved, the way one does with stories that involve deities or deity-like figures. We ask those questions all the time. Why doesn't the all powerful omnipotent figure just do whatever? Reasons™. 

 

Actually, in this case, I don't think any limitations to our power are needed.  She may not be a lucid dreamer in which case she doesn't have any ability to consciously shape reality, it just arises organically from her imagination.

[agirlnamedbob]

Actually, in this case, I don't think any limitations to our power are needed.  She may not be a lucid dreamer in which case she doesn't have any ability to consciously shape reality, it just arises organically from her imagination.

 

That's possible. ...Though... ...I feel like that in and of itself is a limit to Dreamer Power(s). ...Yeah? 

 

 

I feel like we may find out some more about all of this in the last Book, but I'm not expecting this particular issue to be neatly tied up with a pretty bow. 

[MisterMetropolis]

I think that Lux and Yaga are the metaphysical manifestations of duality, light and dark, in the universe, and we're able to see and interact with them in Arcadia because it's a magical world. So is Lux dreaming the universe or is the universe dreaming Lux? It's a chicken and egg thing. And the soulstone would be the universe's life force, again made physical because of the laws of Arcadia. Then when Klacks stole it, Lux started to get sick. He essentially broke the universe. Maybe he stole it around the time Zoe was born, triggering her birth and her purpose to continue the dream.

[Ikon]

I think that Lux is just one of a race of Dreamers, that all have Dreamed their own worlds. 

 

Reminds me of a story I read once, long ago, about the god of our universe being a god-child and our universe is one of their school projects. The universe is going to pot because our god got bored with the project and put it on shelf in their closet

[the red of the kin]

(This also potentially has some interesting implications as far as Zoe saving April if April has in fact been reborn as "The Girl Who Walks Between Worlds.") 

 

Yep. I keep thinking of how Zoe witnesses April's death. She sees it and can't understand how is it that she actually "saved" April.
This could be because she was meant to dream/record this event in order to then ...make stuff happen

[catnip]

I actually have it pretty nicely conceptualized after playing B4. In my opinion Lux is a Walker who just wandered into the domain of Yaga and conjured the Dream. Imagine a two-dimensional plane with Stark being the upper surface, Arcadia the lower one and Storytime the fabric itself. Domain of Lux is located "over" Stark while domain of Yaga is "under" Arcadia, and the sickness that threatens the Dream is imbalance between influence of Lux (order, science) and Yaga (chaos, magic), due to outside forces (the Undreaming? Prophet? Both as one?) bringing science from Stark to Arcadia in an attempt to weed out its random, chaotic, magical nature.
 
[/tinfoilhat]
 

Are they complete and independent worlds? Are they more like alternate dimensions?

 
Looks like the events of TLJ/DF/DFC are to HoAW like pages in a book: time has no meaning and you can just skip to any part of the story, like you can skip pages in a book, or go back a chapter, or re-read it entirely, and the part that you've already read remains known to you and is not erased upon starting another re-read.

[loranna238]

Guys, would be great to know your opinion on what Lux concept really is..

 

When I think of it, I am confused.. We know that Lux has dreamed everything and everything lives because Lux is dreaming...

 

1. But does this mean Lux dreamed not only the twin worlds but also other Galaxies? We know that, for example, Draic kin came from space... In this case, if Lux is ill, are there also problems with other worlds? Why it has to be twin worlds where Lux (or at least his projection) is located? What is happening with other worlds?

 

2. What power does Lux have? If he dreams everything why can't he simply undream the bad guys? What determines Lux's power limits? When I think of this, I suddenly think of Sims analogy... for example, the player is Lux in this case, he/she dreams what the Sims characters will say and do... however, if the player is sick and abandons the game for a while, the characters still continue to live their own life and do some things autonomously..things that the player might have even never wanted... (I think of old Sims version, i think i stopped paying on Sims 3 version )) Could it be what is also happening with Lux and Twin worlds? But in Sims, the player can return and fix everything - is this what Zoe is going to do?

 

My understanding is that it's almost matrixy like but not really.  It's a dream within a dream.  Zoe is able to project - dream herself throughout Lux's reality but she's still connected to her body, which is in Lux's reality.  In other words, Lux is like the superadmin and Zoe is like an admin.  Lux moved all of her properties and rights over the computer/matrix over to Zoe though, deleted her own profile, and now Zoe is super admin.  Lux is the dreamer, but the dreamer became one with one of the things it created in that reality, which revitalized it.  Zoe/Lux, who have a symbiotic relationship at this point, are probably now wicked powerful.  She can most likely now shape reality, not just influence it.  She can change things for real.

 

Which means that her mother probably didn't really understand what she was in for.  And I don't feel very sorry for her either.

[Nancy Brown]

 Lux moved all of her properties and rights over the computer/matrix over to Zoe though, deleted her own profile, and now Zoe is super admin.  L

 

that sounds so cool! I hope one day Ragnar will explain everything to us using this kind of simple analogy)))

 

But still.. what happens with other worlds in this context? Did Lux the super admin just forget those? Why can't Draic Kin relatives come to Arcadia and save their relatives (e.g. white dragon..)...

[Pawlo_86]

Lux and The First Dream things are very mysterious and i would like to see them a little more explained but still left as big mystery.

[Future Markus]

My distinct impression is that Lux is the capital "c" Creator of Earth (pre-division) and all the other worlds that are out there (e.g. Draic Kin homeworld, offworld colonies).

 

It's not at all clear how HoAW relates to this. Quite possibly HoAW is out beyond even Lux's dream.

[Yarrozu]

 

In general I guess the concept of Lux can be compared to the concept of Saga. They both create realities by narrating/drawing/dreaming them. ofcourse Lady Alvane comes to mind too.

We now know Lux was meant to unite with Zoe. Maybe she was sick because zoe was separated from her. I speculate Wati had something to do with it. I suspect Zoe was never born in the human way.

 

 

I've been thinking about this for a while, after playing the games I definitely got the impression that Zoe was in a way made. I suspect this has a lot to do with her mom, made in the same way they did Faith, only Zoe was the 'successful' experiment but she wasn't known to Wati or anything. I hope we'll get some background info on her mom, I'm not 100% convinced she's all bad nor all benevolent towered Zoe. Wasn't there something in games where someone (Abnaxus or one of the Draic?) was saying they weren't expecting Zoe to exist, something like that?

 

And if Lux is the created/dreamt up the universe where does the Baba Yaga come in? Did Lux create them too or was there always that duality, like a yin and yang thing? And are we sure Lux can actively manipulate the worlds or is it a more 'bearing witness' to the worlds kind of thing?