Jump to content


Photo

PROPAST ALL A DREAM!

Zoe Propast April Marcuria Dreamer

  • Please log in to reply
269 replies to this topic

#81 Mapolq

Mapolq

    Rubber Ducky

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 5 posts

Posted 08 December 2015 - 18:33

For the people concerned with "it's all a dream!" as cheap storytelling, it's important to note that in our context, "dream" means Reality 2.0. And judging by what WATI and others seem to be going on about, things that happen in one reality-bubble are influencing others. I don't think it'd be cheap if it turns out Zoe dreamt Propast into being (it's unclear whether she can dream people into being, though, or even if Lux could, or if everyone's "soul" always existed). It poses a number of complicated issues to explain, though, as I mentioned before.


  • the red of the kin likes this

#82 Lianyu

Lianyu

    Rubber Ducky

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 7 posts

Posted 08 December 2015 - 20:54

Its a good theory.  But especially for a game that emphasizes choice, having it all be a "dream", at least one that makes all the relationships and characters you met in the first 3 books in Propast disappear would not be satisfying.

 

personally i'm more interested in the fate of all the characters from dreamfall, Helena Chang, alvin peets, Damien Cavanaugh, olivia demarco, zoe's dad, which we have not gotten any info in DFC so far.


  • the red of the kin likes this

#83 Olstyle

Olstyle

    Vestrum Crier

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 597 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 08 December 2015 - 21:34

Did we ever have a scene where Zoe was dreaming, but where she was dreaming herself to was not "real"(meaning not touched by other people)? Even Winter could be observed by Wati and had a direct influence on the other world, so this was "real" too.
  • SantaMonica99 and Hellegennes like this

#84 Kardn

Kardn

    Rubber Ducky

  • Vestrum
  • Pip
  • 21 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 09 December 2015 - 08:18

I don't know if I'm the only one, but many things we do in Propast, we have already done in Casablanca.

Baruti and Olivia are simmilar. Both dig deeper into an consipracy and die in the end.

Or we help Reza again to unveal a big story. This time he is not missing. But why is he back. Unharmed. Same Job without consequences from Dreamfall.

 

I felt Propast was a big Deja Vu from Dreamfall. Kinda doing the same things. Only Arcadia was progressing and stepping forward.

And different People tried to connect to Zoe while in coma to help her remember and to wake her up.


  • Pawlo_86 likes this

#85 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 09 December 2015 - 08:24

I don't know if I'm the only one, but many things we do in Propast, we have already done in Casablanca.

Baruti and Olivia are simmilar. Both dig deeper into an consipracy and die in the end.

Or we help Reza again to unveal a big story. This time he is not missing. But why is he back. Unharmed. Same Job without consequences from Dreamfall.

 

I felt Propast was a big Deja Vu from Dreamfall. Kinda doing the same things. Only Arcadia was progressing and stepping forward.

And different People tried to connect to Zoe while in coma to help her remember and to wake her up.

 

You can be on something. Zoe discovered WATicorp conspiracy like in Dreamfall.

 

But my theory is that Zoe dreamed herself into Propast while being still in coma in Casablanca. Her Dreamer body was in Propast, then travelled to Arcadia and saved and unificated with Lux. At the result Zoe awake from coma with super Dreamer powers. I like the theoory that Falk "saved" Dreamer- Zoe to prevent her from wake up and that he works for Helena Chang and WATIcorp. After death of Peats Gillmore and Chang are new heads of WATIcorp.


  • Riaise and Kardn like this

#86 Kardn

Kardn

    Rubber Ducky

  • Vestrum
  • Pip
  • 21 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 09 December 2015 - 08:42

We know, she dreamt Propast and was still in coma (body disapearing when switching to Arcadia and when she finally left the hospital room end book 4).

 

About Falk... I still think he is an ally. He saved her when the "Eye" tried to stop her from using the "Dreamer". Cause she escaped Propast with it.

And was Zoe back to Propast since traveling to Arcadia? She went to Arcadia, found the Resistánce and never went back. Or am I mistaken?


  • Pawlo_86 likes this

#87 khh

khh

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Moderator
  • 7118 posts
  • LocationNorway

Posted 09 December 2015 - 09:28

personally i'm more interested in the fate of all the characters from dreamfall, Helena Chang, alvin peets, Damien Cavanaugh, olivia demarco, zoe's dad, which we have not gotten any info in DFC so far.

The first therapy session Zoë has with Dr. Zelenka at the beginning of Dreamfall Chapters, they do mention Damien Cavanaugh and Olivia. They're both dead, though, unfortunately. At least if we're to believe the info we've gotten.
  • SantaMonica99 likes this

April Ryan is my friend,
Every sorrow she can mend.
When I visit her dark realm,
Does it simply overwhelm.


#88 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 09 December 2015 - 09:38

personally i'm more interested in the fate of all the characters from dreamfall, Helena Chang, alvin peets, Damien Cavanaugh, olivia demarco, zoe's dad, which we have not gotten any info in DFC so far.

 

Helena Chang - we got a confirmation that she is Zoe's mother, not much abot her in Book 1-4,

Alvin Peats - nothing about him in Book 1-4,

Damien - it was told that he was used for WATI cover story about Static and he made suicide,

Liv - it was told that she died in accident,

Gabriel - we know that he left Casablanca and moved to Mombai,


  • Kardn and Hellegennes like this

#89 Kardn

Kardn

    Rubber Ducky

  • Vestrum
  • Pip
  • 21 posts
  • LocationGermany

Posted 09 December 2015 - 09:49

Pretty much everything about Casablanca/old Stark is left behind with this few explanations :(



#90 Lianyu

Lianyu

    Rubber Ducky

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 7 posts

Posted 10 December 2015 - 03:57

We know, she dreamt Propast and was still in coma (body disapearing when switching to Arcadia and when she finally left the hospital room end book 4).

 

About Falk... I still think he is an ally. He saved her when the "Eye" tried to stop her from using the "Dreamer". Cause she escaped Propast with it.

And was Zoe back to Propast since traveling to Arcadia? She went to Arcadia, found the Resistánce and never went back. Or am I mistaken?

 

 

yes, zoe put on the dreammachine in Mira's shop to go into Arcadia, but when she wake up, she was not back in mira's shop, but in her coma.



#91 lunitaire

lunitaire

    Rubber Ducky

  • Vestrum
  • Pip
  • 20 posts
  • LocationModern Day Atlantis

Posted 11 December 2015 - 03:08

What if Propast is basically like the Matrix, ie WatiCorp is slowly but surely plugging everybody into this virtual world between worlds? The ones who use Dream Machines simply go to Propast instead of returning home after leaving their more far fetched dreams. And others might not even realize they are not in reality any longer. If that is the case, then I have to wonder if dying in Propast results in actual death or if it just causes a person to wake up. 


  • Pawlo_86 likes this

#92 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 11 December 2015 - 06:53

The man close Seshandri Tower:

What if this all is dream and we're connected to the Dreamer all the time?

This quote was always strange for me. And RTG said that lens flares effect was intentional for dream-feeling.
  • loranna238 likes this

#93 ct2651

ct2651

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Istrum
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2117 posts

Posted 11 December 2015 - 06:55


*notice how I just casually mention Zoe dreaming herself into Propast, like this is something people do every day.... :)

 

Of course, it's completely normal XD.


  • the red of the kin likes this

#94 msierchio

msierchio

    Fringe Café Regular

  • Minstrum
  • PipPip
  • 72 posts
  • LocationBerkeley, California,US

Posted 11 December 2015 - 07:53

This is not a dream, but you are dreaming.


  • loranna238, Pawlo_86 and the red of the kin like this

#95 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 11 December 2015 - 08:25

This is not a dream, but you are dreaming.

 

White Dragon said this in Dreamfall. But this was little diffrent. Zoe's body was in Stark but he dreamed herself into Arcadia. Propast is diffrent. Zoe's body is in Stark and she dreamed herself into Stark and Arcadia? And all those people "YOU' RE DREAMING!" "WAKE UP!". The girl from Storytime...Maybe Propast was Zoe's "nightmare" in Storytime? Also notice that when Zoe started to complete her "remember all" task she was allowed to dream herself into Arcadia again.

 

It seems like Propast was some kind of "dream prison" for Zoe which prevent her to go to Arcadia to save Lux and wake up in Stark.


  • msierchio likes this

#96 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 11 December 2015 - 08:55

What if Propast is basically like the Matrix, ie WatiCorp is slowly but surely plugging everybody into this virtual world between worlds? The ones who use Dream Machines simply go to Propast instead of returning home after leaving their more far fetched dreams. And others might not even realize they are not in reality any longer. If that is the case, then I have to wonder if dying in Propast results in actual death or if it just causes a person to wake up. 

 

As i said there is one clue about it in Chapter 2. The guy and girl are talking near staris, close to Seshandri Tower. The guy said that he had best Dreamtime ever. At the end of speaking the guy started to question if they're all connected to The Dreamer all the time and Propast is just a dream. IF yes, if Propast is really a dreamworld created by WATIcorp to "prison" all who used Dreamer then Zoe had a very strong influence in this world. After all Zoe went to coma when she was connected to Dreamer...


  • loranna238 likes this

#97 magic88889

magic88889

    Vestrum Crier

  • Vestrum
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 687 posts

Posted 11 December 2015 - 09:33

I don't see the problem with her dreaming herself to some place in Stark.  I mean it's just as real as Arcadia, so what's the difference?  Just because her body is also in Stark, that suddenly makes it impossible? 

And if it really is all some kind of construct created by Wati, what would be the point of the political race rigging, or the EYE lock-down?  And then coming to kill Zoe?  I'm just not sure how any of the events make sense if they aren't real.

 

And when Zoe finally puts on the Dreamer, and transfers herself to Arcadia, how does that work?  She's lying in a coma, with a dreamer on, in some fictional construct, and puts on a dreamer in this construct, and then suddenly she's not in said construct, but in an entirely different world?  Also, I didn't see a Dreamer in any of the scenes of her in the hospital bed.

 

No, with the way things play out, it makes much more sense that Zoe is in a coma in Casablanca (as we see her wake up at the end of book 4, and trying to wake up at the end of book 2), and is Dreaming herself to other places.  First Storytime, then Propast, and then Arcadia, before finally waking up.  So all the events she experiences are real, just that she wasn't physically there.


  • Riaise likes this

#98 magritte

magritte

    Vestrum Crier

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 925 posts

Posted 11 December 2015 - 20:48

I wonder if she's really even waking up in a true bodily sense at the end or whether, after her encounter with Lux, she's now awake to her abilities as a Dreamer so that she can choose to dream herself wherever she wants.  



#99 Pawlo_86

Pawlo_86

    Harbinger of the Balance

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2736 posts
  • LocationPoland

Posted 11 December 2015 - 21:07

I replayed Propast and i think that Propast was real and Zoe dreamed herself there while she was still in coma. I think that as Dreamer she made some changes to Propast. Remove rain etc. But all characters and events were real.

Zoe is united with Lux and Nox. She has super Dreamer powers now. Those powers may allow her to beat WATIcorp and stop Dreamer Project. But will she create her own world at the end? Will time back to TLJ timeline and remove Dreamer Cycle from reality? Will she dream April and this will explain how she saved her? Book Five.

#100 magritte

magritte

    Vestrum Crier

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 925 posts

Posted 11 December 2015 - 21:10

I replayed Propast and i think that Propast was real and Zoe dreamed herself there while she was still in coma. I think that as Dreamer she made some changes to Propast. Remove rain etc. But all characters and events were real.

I think everything Zoe dreams is real.  That doesn't mean it was necessarily real before she began dreaming or that the same events would have happened there.

 

I'm increasingly of the opinion that she "saved" April in the same way that she does the Yaga, by remembering her.  Because Zoe remembers her, the story of the Dragon of Spring will recur in some fashion in the next cycle, possibly embodied by Saga or perhaps just told by her (Saga is Ragnar!).


  • Pawlo_86 likes this





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Zoe, Propast, April, Marcuria, Dreamer

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users