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PROPAST ALL A DREAM!

Zoe Propast April Marcuria Dreamer

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#61 Pawlo_86

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Posted 07 December 2015 - 20:38

One of the NPC in Propast said - "What if this is all dream and we are connected to Dreamer all the time?"

#62 the red of the kin

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Posted 07 December 2015 - 23:16

although it is also true that at first Zoe is in Dreamtime and she saves a little girl. Then in Propast the girl remembers her.

Now. The girl might be a memory of Zoe, who then dreamed this memory, along with all of Propast.

 

And I thought I couldn't do any worse than Inception :P


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#63 Ikon

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 01:41

My wife feels that same as you about Inception. OTOH, I actually followed the logic pretty well, but then my mind is a maze locked inside an enigma anyway.


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#64 Lianyu

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 02:52

more parallel between Propast and Arcadia:

revolutionaries in propast is fighting the Eye, rebels in Arcadia is fighting Azadi

Nela is like April, nela died attacking the eye, april was killed by Azadis

Seshadri Tower is just like the tower in Arcadia

 

Mira on the other hand seems very similar to Olivia DeMarco

 

see April's death https://youtu.be/PGp_qfrQ13w?t=9m2s it's quite similar to Nela's death

 

after Nela's death. Zoe is shown to be still in coma  https://youtu.be/HbN8g8h_E8Q?t=57m38s



#65 Mapolq

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 03:08

The start of DFC when Zoe frees the people stuck in Dreamtime (including the girl she later meets in Propast) are probably the weakest link in that theory. But I still feel the existance of "notReza" is a bigger problem for Propast being a place in Stark. It really could be either, though, or something else entirely.  :P

It probably requires a big supposition though, that pretty much everyone who's dreaming oneself into Propast doesn't ever leave it. So I guess Propast in Stark seems more plausible, and I just like the other idea.



#66 spteng

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 04:40

Its a good theory.  But especially for a game that emphasizes choice, having it all be a "dream", at least one that makes all the relationships and characters you met in the first 3 books in Propast disappear would not be satisfying.



#67 Pawlo_86

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 07:32

more parallel between Propast and Arcadia:

revolutionaries in propast is fighting the Eye, rebels in Arcadia is fighting Azadi

Nela is like April, nela died attacking the eye, april was killed by Azadis

Seshadri Tower is just like the tower in Arcadia

 

There are more like EYE forcing people to connect to Dreamtime all the time while Azadi are finishing The Engine.

 

The parallel events between Stark and Arcadia were started in Dreamfall and this is perfectly continued in Dreamfall Chapters. I pretty like it!



#68 Riaise

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 14:44

Here's a thought. If Propast is real, and Zoe did dream herself into it, what does that say about Friedman saving Zoe in her apartment? I mean, if she's only dreaming herself into Propast, can she really be shot, or even killed? Yes, she seems to have been injured by the explosion, but is that just because she dreamed that she must have been injured? When she wakes up in her coma bed, is she going to have rejuv marks on her face?

 

Perhaps Falk is saving her from dying in the dream to stop her from waking up in real life. She almost died in the explosion and we saw her twitch, as if almost waking up, in her hospital bed. Falk dragged her away from the explosion site and, presumably, got her to hospital as quickly as possible so that she didn't "die" and wake up. He also stopped the EYE from attacking her because, again, she would have "died" and woken up from her coma.


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#69 Vardark

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 15:09

It cannot be all a dream. The cutscenes with Falk Friedman proves that the world is moving on independently of Zoë



#70 Ikon

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 15:34

It cannot be all a dream. The cutscenes with Falk Friedman proves that the world is moving on independently of Zoë

 

I think it could be argued that Zoe doesn't have to be directly involved in a scene to be dreaming it. She could have dreamed the scene with Friedman as part of her overall dream. I'm not saying I agree that that's the case, but I think it's a fair argument.


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#71 Ikon

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 15:37

Perhaps Falk is saving her from dying in the dream to stop her from waking up in real life. She almost died in the explosion and we saw her twitch, as if almost waking up, in her hospital bed. Falk dragged her away from the explosion site and, presumably, got her to hospital as quickly as possible so that she didn't "die" and wake up. He also stopped the EYE from attacking her because, again, she would have "died" and woken up from her coma.

 

That's a fair point. Keeping her in a coma could well be a way of preventing her from intervening with evil plans.


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#72 Kardn

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 15:57

I wonder...

 

A Shifter can "shift" between worlds. So can only exist in one world (Stark OR Arcadia)

 

A Dreamer can "dream" her/himself between worlds. Existing in two worlds (Arcadia and Stark).

But can a Dreamer dream her/himself into the same world? Stark and Stark? Wouldn't that be Zoe's case? Is that possible?

I can only remember her (Zoe) ending in Arcadia every time.

 

If it is not possible to dream yourself into the same world...we would have Stark, Arcadia AND Propast....


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#73 Ikon

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 16:19

I would presume that a Dreamer can dream pretty much anything. After all, it is dreaming.


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#74 Kardn

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 16:40

Would assume, you can dream yourself right next to yourself dreaming? Then it is not dreaming.



#75 Vardark

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 16:44

I think it could be argued that Zoe doesn't have to be directly involved in a scene to be dreaming it. She could have dreamed the scene with Friedman as part of her overall dream. I'm not saying I agree that that's the case, but I think it's a fair argument.

But she doesn't remember/know about those cutscenes when entering Arcadia. If she did, she would know that Propast isn't real.



#76 the red of the kin

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 16:48

Zoe's a dreamer and when she dreams herself somewhere she disappears from where she previously was.
Even when she unites with Lux, she says her goodbyes to Crow and simply stops existing in Arcadia.

 

So no: I'd say she's not capable of being in two separate places at once...unless we're talking about her being at the time in Stark (induced coma) on one side and Dreamtime-Propast-Arcadia on the other side


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#77 Kardn

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 17:22

This is exactly my thought. Propast is not in Stark and dreamt by Zoe. She dreamt Propast true (according to Faith a dreamer can dream things true).

An with remembering slowly, the world she created slowly changed and faded. Queenie mentions it. She left the world, before it colapsed.


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#78 magic88889

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 17:26

I can see how it would fit, but I'd be really disappointing unless it was done in an extremely clever way.  The whole "It's all a dream" thing has been done to death, and as mentioned by others, it would mean that everything that we did in Propast in the first three books was meaningless.  I somehow doubt Ragnar would write it that way.



#79 Kardn

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 17:48

I wouldn't say meaningless. It was important for her. Don't forget, that Wati and Helena are still in the game.

Zoe could have been manipulated with drugs or from an overdose while trying to wake up the first time. Didn't she overload the medicine while

in Dreamtime? Was that really her or was she reacting to something that happend to her? Did someone try to enter her brain/dream? Therefore the memory loss.

So she had to remember to break free from her own dream. The journey back to Arcadia and back into the game.

 

My suggestion is, she was put into her own dream by Wati/Helena to get her out of the way. That she is under control while the dreamer is on its way.

And Queenie, Falk and her psycho-doc tried to break her free. With success.



#80 CosmicD

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 18:00

Hmm, It would be a bit weird if all of propast was a dream as we would preceive dreams. Because why else would you even want to uncover the truth behind all of the political power corruption, scan stuff in the warehouse and then entrust that info to hanna ? 

If the research facility theory holds up, then I wonder how she has been able to dream herself into propast and there would effectively be 2 zoë's in stark, one projected version and one physical version in the research center. A bunch of shady people would notice this and maybe that's why the eye was tracking her in her apartment in book 3 ? According to me, Falk Friedman is sent by an ally who wants her to survive possible capture and "deletion" by the eye, who are ofcourse controlled by waticorp. Falk saved her 2 times. I'm building further on my theory that people in the real world have caused her to wake up, the bomb was one attempt.

But... as always I hope I'm wrong and it's more interesting.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Zoe, Propast, April, Marcuria, Dreamer

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