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Why April can't shift?

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#1 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 12:46

I didn't see a discussion about this, so my apologies if this has already been thoroughly analyzed.

As anyone who played the game knows, April can no longer shift in DF. Although it may be some mental issue, I have a different theory.

As the white of the kin said, April can't shift on her own and she doesn't know why that is, I think the answer is simple.

A shift goes through the world of dreams, we know that already. And we know the Guardian tells April that dreams are going one way only from Stark to Arcadia.

I think it would be logical to add 2+2 and deduce that as long as dreams are going one way, so April can only shift to Arcadia, or if she's there, she will be unable to return to Stark.

 

What do you think?



#2 Lee-m

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 14:06

It has been discussed at length many times. Maybe others can give you links to old discussions on the other two forums.

To try and sum it up, she can't shift because she has lost faith in her self and in the balance. Read more about April in this current thread: http://redthreadgame...we-make-of-her/

#3 Silvirish4ever

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 14:21

Yes, it has been discussed, but not in this forum yet...

 

And I think that the point is very interesting. In Dreamfall we learn that dreams are being transferred from Stark to Arcadia, but not the other way around. Which could explain why April cannot shift from Arcadia to Stark anymore. It doesn't mean that she could not do it from Stark to Arcadia - but evidently, we could never know. 

 

The thing is that, in that case, the whole issue about Zoë being able to "save April" would make sense: Zoë is apparently a rare case, whose dreams can move freely between Arcadia and Stark regardless of what is going on with the Dreamer and all that. Which would maybe give April a way to shift again...? 

 

No idea how Crow fits into all this, though. But if he was able to "research" what crows are like in Stark (and get mad about it in TLJ), he must have some way of moving between both worlds, as well  :crow:


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#4 DiskJunky

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 14:25

Or a way of finding out even if not first hand :)


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#5 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 16:05

It has been discussed at length many times. Maybe others can give you links to old discussions on the other two forums.

To try and sum it up, she can't shift because she has lost faith in her self and in the balance. Read more about April in this current thread: http://redthreadgame...we-make-of-her/

 

If it's only a matter of faith, why the white of the Kin said that she can't shift on her own and she doesn't know why?

The mental/psychological approach here is not enough to accomodate for all the information we have.



#6 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 16:07

Yes, it has been discussed, but not in this forum yet...

 

And I think that the point is very interesting. In Dreamfall we learn that dreams are being transferred from Stark to Arcadia, but not the other way around. Which could explain why April cannot shift from Arcadia to Stark anymore. It doesn't mean that she could not do it from Stark to Arcadia - but evidently, we could never know. 

 

The thing is that, in that case, the whole issue about Zoë being able to "save April" would make sense: Zoë is apparently a rare case, whose dreams can move freely between Arcadia and Stark regardless of what is going on with the Dreamer and all that. Which would maybe give April a way to shift again...? 

 

No idea how Crow fits into all this, though. But if he was able to "research" what crows are like in Stark (and get mad about it in TLJ), he must have some way of moving between both worlds, as well  :crow:

 

You make excellent arguments. Although I think Crow visiting Stark is a bit too much, the point about saving April makes a little more sense.



#7 thelj

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 16:51

 

A shift goes through the world of dreams, we know that already. And we know the Guardian tells April that dreams are going one way only from Stark to Arcadia.

I think it would be logical to add 2+2 and deduce that as long as dreams are going one way, so April can only shift to Arcadia, or if she's there, she will be unable to return to Stark.

 

What do you think?

I quite like your theory but there's one problem.Crow said to Zoe that at first April didn't want to shift and then one day she just couldn't.So,April "lost" her shifting abilities when she was still with Crow,sometime during the 2 years that follow the events of TLJ.That would mean that the flow of dreams from Arcadia to Stark had already stopped by that time which i don't think is the case.The whole "dreams flowing only one way" is obviously something that ties with the Alchera conspiracy,the Azadi tower and the events that take place during Dreamfall.


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#8 Lee-m

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 17:05

If it's only a matter of faith, why the white of the Kin said that she can't shift on her own and she doesn't know why?
The mental/psychological approach here is not enough to accomodate for all the information we have.

Because im pretty sure Ragnar has said so. I wish I could quote sources but I never keep track of that stuff. Its been a long time. But thats the theme of dreamfall, loss of faith (and Faith).

As pointed out by thelj, there would be some serious date issues with it being connected to the dream stealing part of the plot.

More importantly, its a game mechanic to stop you just shifting to stark every time Aprils life is in danger, or she needs to buy a gun to shoot some Azadi. She could just Shift to the other side of the underground river thing via stark if she had shifting powers for example. Shifting is pretty much a free for all teleport super power.
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#9 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 19:14

Disregarding the reason shifting was written out from Dreamfall (I agree it would make April too powerful. I wonder how they are going to address that in TLJH), I don't think the theories are mutually exclusive.

 

Take this scenario for example:

1. April doesn't want to shift

2. April loses the faith in herself so she can't open a portal

3. a few years pass by

4. Now even if she wanted to, and believed in herself again, she still can't do it *on her own*, because of the flow of dreams to Arcadia.

 

I think it's very much possible, and would fit as the missing piece in the puzzle. (Given that the Kin doesn't know what is obstructing April's ability, we can assume it has a direct connection to current events)

 

As a side note, how cool will it be if April, mortally wounded, would shift to a stark hospital to get treated, but it will be pretty hard tying it to the rest of the story.


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#10 thelj

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 20:52

 

1. April doesn't want to shift

2. April loses the faith in herself so she can't open a portal

3. a few years pass by

4. Now even if she wanted to, and believed in herself again, she still can't do it *on her own*, because of the flow of dreams to Arcadia.

 

 

Yes,your theory makes better sense now.Sounds good to me.  :)

 

What really bugs me,though,is how was April able to shift to the Guardian's realm.Is there a seperate flow of dreams to and fro the Guardian's realm besides the known Arcadia->Stark and Stark->Arcadia?Or is Crow special because he helped April shift without the presence of a dream flow?  :unsure:



#11 Silvirish4ever

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 20:58

Well, like I said, I don't know how Crow fits into all this, but he is an important piece. I'd say he has something going on with the Guardian's Realm.

 

He already shifted there in TLJ after April calls for him (?!!), and in Dreamfall apparently he's the key to unlock April's power - but again, to the Guardian's Realm...


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#12 thelj

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 21:11

Maybe he was a Guardian himshelf in his previous life.  :P​ 

(that's why he learned to speak the human language,being ex-human and all...)



#13 Lee-m

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 21:18

What really bugs me,though,is how was April able to shift to the Guardian's realm.

As I understand it, she can't. But the Kin have access to it, and thus the white of the kin channeled her power (like Cortez in TLJ) so she could go there.

Once your inside the rules change, you can leave to anyplace you like, or invite others in. I think at least 2 ppl in TLJ tell you this, maybe Tobias and Adrian.

The whole crow thing is another plot device so you get to take him with you :) At least until we are given real evidence to the contrary.

#14 DiskJunky

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 21:24

this is making my head spin. Is there any one place where the story is written down so I can read it? Yes, I know, play the game...but I've tried and the written word would help on catching up :)


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#15 Lee-m

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 21:32

this is making my head spin. Is there any one place where the story is written down so I can read it? Yes, I know, play the game...but I've tried and the written word would help on catching up :)

you could try tljwiki: http://tlj.wikia.com/wiki/TLJwiki
I think wandrew and a few others have been updating it over the last 10 years or so. I never read it my self, but I would think that would be the place to start.
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#16 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 21:33

What really bugs me,though,is how was April able to shift to the Guardian's realm.Is there a seperate flow of dreams to and fro the Guardian's realm besides the known Arcadia->Stark and Stark->Arcadia?Or is Crow special because he helped April shift without the presence of a dream flow?  :unsure:

That bugs me as well. I thought only the guardian can open a portal to the realm. That's why April boarded the shuttle to the colonies in TLJ she couldn't shift there so she needed the physical entrance.

 

The white kin specifically said she helped April channel her own power (I guess like Cortez did) saying April can shift, just not on her own.

 

I'll tell you one thing, Ragnar had better created a vacuum tight plot, because the smallest discontinuity is going to drive some (me) insane  :wacko:



#17 thelj

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 22:01


The whole crow thing is another plot device so you get to take him with you :) At least until we are given real evidence to the contrary.

You're probably right and i'm just burning grey cells over nothing...

 

 

 

 

I'll tell you one thing, Ragnar had better created a vacuum tight plot, because the smallest discontinuity is going to drive some (me) insane  :wacko:

I get the feeling.



#18 Crowboy

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 22:13

A thought just occurred to me.

I've always assumed April is a Stark resident.

What if it's the other way around? What if she's originally from Arcadia and she shifted early in her life to Stark (perhaps with the help of the kin to protect her)

We know she's adopted, and she has some relation to the white of the kin, who is native to Arcadia.

That may help explain why she can't leave Arcadia on her own (I think)

 

That will also make the title "The Longest Journey Home" very interesting



#19 Lee-m

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 22:27

That may help explain why she can't leave Arcadia on her own (I think)

No it wouldn't, at least not with the information we are given. As it stands she should be free to shift between worlds as much as she likes. Maybe later RTG will put some kind of restrictions on it, so it can be used in game play.

besides, she shifts out of arcadia just fine in TLJ.

As for the rest, if I remember rightly, that's all been thought up before (almost everything has), but its just speculation, we have no info to go on.

#20 CosmicD

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 22:48

As a side note, how cool will it be if April, mortally wounded, would shift to a stark hospital to get treated, but it will be pretty hard tying it to the rest of the story.

 

That has been my theory for long already. You know how she's always able to shift especiall when she's afraid. Back in TLJ the most shifting that she has done was out of a panicky situjation.

So imagine what happens if she gets knifed ?


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