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Anti-Aliasing in TLJ (also regarding flickering) - Update (from old Forum)


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#1 ghost_zero5

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 13:27

Hi,

when I was trying to run TLJ with good AA on my new PC I run into this thread
http://www.theundrea...Aliasing-in-TLJ

escpecially regarding the flickering. And although the thread provides a solution by setting bool_IsDoubleBuffer=0 and bool_ForceSingleBuffer=0 this greatly reduces the quality of AA in the game.
As I also was unable to see various items that way, e.g. the diary would always be "invisible" when opening it but I still wanted to have good AA quality, so I looked further an found the thread below.

However, if I want to keep double buffer active I always got the flickering until I found this solution:
http://steamcommunit...80278002576177/

This script works really well, it basically uses a window mode to emulate full screen. What is nice that it does not rearange my desktop icons which might be a problem if I change resolution manually.
The only thing that I need to make sure is that I have no open "windows" on the desktop because those would be resized, e.g. an instant messanger should be minimized to tray before running the game that way.

Just as information for any who might need it.

This full screen emulation will work once you are in the main menu. The first video sequence (basically the FunCom video) before the main menu, will still have the "window borders" visible (at least on Win8.1 64Bit) but after that it completely emulates full screen which should be enough as it is the gameplay and everything else, just not the FunCom video.

 

The script is designed for the steam version (but might need to be modified to use full path to Steam.exe) but should be easily changeable for other versions of the game.


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#2 trentjaspar

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 15:53

Hmm, I'll have to try that some time.  I never was able to get AA to work properly with TLJ.

Thanks!


"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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#3 Edreamer Jamil

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 00:10

I've bookmarked the link (many thanks for it) but I'm not at home and it may be a while before I get to try this
I noticed the poster with the solution was using an AMD card; I recall others with AMD cards have previously offered fixes, but that none of those so far have been confirmed to work properly with Nvidia cards

If anyone with an Nvidia card gets a chance to try this with success I'd be grateful if they could confirm this here
I'll do likewise if I do

#4 ghost_zero5

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 11:48

Just a small update before you start the script you need to make sure that you have steam already running and logged in because otherwise it might not work correctly.

 

Not sure if it will work on nVidia cards as I have a AMD card currently but you could give it a try - would be interesting to know.

 

Regarding nVidia cards I also found this thread, however:

http://forums.steamp...ad.php?t=558994

 

Maybe you can try a combination of both because the script itself is rather "universal" as it switches to the natvie resolution and runs the game in "window mode" - interestingly that way it seems to avoid the flickering. It is, of course, not perfect because it needs to change the resolution but as it automatically changes back - and at least on my system (win8 64bit) it seems to keep the desktop icons in place, it is the best solution I was able to find so far.

 

EDIT:

One last information. Sometimes the script does not remove the window borderes for me. This doesn't happen often but when it does it is enough to simply close the game and restart it (maybe the wait time between the starting of the game and the nircmd command is a bit too small). Anyway the game starts fast anyway so it really is not much of a problem.


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#5 Simplex

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 15:13

Regarding nVidia cards I also found this thread, however:

http://forums.steamp...ad.php?t=558994

 

This topic is 7 years old and unfortunately is completely useless in 2014 - I even think it was never useful, people were reporting issues with antialiasing from the start of this topic, for example:

Anti-aliasing is broken for me with TLJ. April looks great, but all other graphics are messed up - something to do with NVIDIA AA expecting every frame to update every pixel, while the game only updates the moving parts, or something like that.

 

This is exactly the problem that I have.

 

From what I learned by searching various forums, there is currently no way to get a working antialiasing (without glitches - i.e. disappearing objects) on nVidia GeForce graphics cards :(

Is there any chance that someone (I don't know who, perhaps someone from Red Thread Games, or someone else who took part in developing the game?) could provide a fix that would enable antialiasing? Or perhaps an option to render the game "offscreen" in a much highe resolution and scale it back to the original 640x480? Or render the game in higher resolution - the 2D background would scale from 640x480 and the 3d characters rendered in high resolution would not be so pixellated and blocky as in 640x480 - even at 1280x960 (doubled resolution) the characters would have 4x times the resolution of the original and then antialiasing would not be necessary (I mean it would still be welcome, but the upscaled models would still look good without it)

Or perhaps there is a way to make post-processing antialiasing (such as FXAA or SMAA) work with TLJ? Any solution that softens the jaggies on character models would be appreciated. I am playing on a 55'' TV and pixels in 640x480 resolution are really large.

 

I think that the TLJ community is quite large and with upcoming release of Chapters many people would like to replay TLJ to refresh their memory, so I hope that by some miracle a coding genius will emerge from the community and fix antialiasing support. Fingers crossed! :)



#6 Lee-m

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 16:08

There was a more recent thread on this here also: http://redthreadgame...anti#entry19410 maybe that would be some help.
 

if your playing on a big TV screen I shouldn't think there is much you can do to improve that 640x480 original image size. It really was intended for an era of much smaller pc monitors. The backdrop images are a fixed size.



#7 Simplex

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 17:53

There was a more recent thread on this here also: http://redthreadgame...anti#entry19410 maybe that would be some help.
 
if your playing on a big TV screen I shouldn't think there is much you can do to improve that 640x480 original image size. It really was intended for an era of much smaller pc monitors. The backdrop images are a fixed size.

I know they are, but they scale well - they are not even pixelated, just a bit more blurry. The backgrounds scale really well, it is the character models that look bad in 640x480 with no antialiasing. With AA they look much, much better.
This is a scene from the beginning of the game upscaled to 1080p - it is blurry, but still looks good.
https://dl.dropboxus...24 18.58.43.jpg

http://www.theundrea...Aliasing-in-TLJ - you can see here that people who enabled AA say that it is a huge improvement, but causes issues on nVidia cards.
 
I already read that topic you linked to - it has tips for Radeon users, but as I previously mentioned, antialiasing works on ATI Radeon cards, but not nVidia GeForce cards.

#8 Pylons of Light

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 08:06

For archive purposes, this is the initial post that was in the old forum thread that this thread refers to:

 


You can adjust anti-aliasing with either the AMD Catalyst Control Center or the NVIDIA Control Panel, depending on your video card manufacturer.

Post your video card model (and driver if possible), glitches incurred, and any modifications (such as updating or rolling back drivers, especially on NVIDIA cards) that helped. I have also made this a poll since I thought it could be interesting to get percentages on how many people have had luck enabling AA, which in my opinion improves the visuals quite a bit (as does changing the font from Florentine Script to Slurry). Apparently various NVIDIA users have also had luck in past with nHancer, though it's since been discontinued.



Result: Success
GPU: Radeon HD 7870 (Catalyst Software Suite 12.10)
Version: GOG.com
Side effects: None
I was getting flickering regardless of my chosen settings until I used the trick in the first post here of running Configure.exe to force preferences.ini to reset itself (it didn't have the DirectX category, and, more importantly, an "int_BitDepth=32" value, until I used Configure.exe). After that, I deleted the old Game.exe profile in Catalyst and started a fresh one using anti-aliasing and all flickering went away. I tried this process on two different hard drives using the same drivers; in one hard drive, flickering still occurred until I used both anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering, but that requirement then vanished. The degree of anti-aliasing and the other settings used seem to make no difference at this point.

Result: 95% success
GPU: GeForce 7800 GS (AGP) (driver: 275.33)
Version: GOG.com
Side effects: Occasional nearly invisible blur where the mouse has moved
Originally I had problems with all the 3D models appearing as garbled triangles unless I ran the game in software mode, but by rolling back the driver (removing the old driver first, of course) I was able to get hardware mode working. AA works without flickering, but makes the mouse leave blurry trails on the screen. However, these are removed almost entirely by unchecking "Force single buffering" in Configure.exe (or setting "bool_IsDoubleBuffer=1" in preferences.ini). The game looks much better in this state than it does without AA, and the leftover glitches are extremely minor.

 

Plenty of people had luck getting AA working, particularly by setting
bool_IsDoubleBuffer=0
and
bool_ForceSingleBuffer=0
in preferences.ini to solve flickering problems.


#9 Edreamer Jamil

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 08:41

Just to confirm that windowed script 'fix' didn't help at all for me, nor (please post if you found otherwise) any other Nvidia user I have yet seen post in providing AA without missing graphics

#10 Simplex

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 14:42

I did research, I experimented with various settings, but as far as I know it is not possible to get AA without issues on modern nvidia cards. I hope someone can prove me wrong.

 

That is why I am hoping that the iOS port will be "backported" to PC (or Android, or both). Currently PC is more disadvantaged about playing TLJ than iOS.



#11 Pylons of Light

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 01:20

Of the 4 NVIDIA reports that were in that topic, 3 failed. (I happen to have saved this old forum topic off as an HTML file.)

 

Result: Success? (Haven't played enough to know.)
GPU: GTX 670 (also tested with two in SLI) (driver: 314.22)
Version: GOG.com
Side effects: None yet

 

Result - Limited success (AA problem)
GPU : GTX 680
Version : GOG.com
Side Effects : AA looks great - April for example has a perfectly smooth outline. Unfortunately key parts of the background (and foreground) are missing. For example in the first scene the top of the tree is missing. As April walks to the right the tree top reappears as the ground shudders in-game but you can't see the egg at all, so nothing appears to be happening. You can't see the root either

 

exactly the same with GTX 460

 

TLDR: partially works, I wouldn't play the game with any of the AA settings.

Details:
VGA: GTX 660
OS: Win 8.1
Driver: 331.58
Game version: 2CD (GamesPlanet / Metaboli)
Fullscreen

Forced FXAA results: aliasing is reduced everywhere, which also makes the backgrounds blurry. April displays perfectly, but other 3D objects completely disappear.
Forced 4xMSAA results: aliasing works on every 3D object. April displays perfectly, but others phase in and out seemingly at random.


#12 Edreamer Jamil

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 01:28

There were a couple modern GeForce posters who did get AA working. I will post their responses here. (I happen to have saved this old forum topic off as an HTML file.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There was also one report of failure:

 

Thanks. Of those 3 , two effectively stated the AA didn't work without graphical issues and the first who just stated he hadn't played the game enough to know, I guess we'll never know what happened next ;)

There was also a poster on one of the forums who stated something like "90% working" but without clarification.

 

The graphical issues that occur with AA on nvidia unfortunately significantly affect gameplay and immersion (not being able to see stuff you need to interact with)

Fortunately you soon forget to moan about jaggies as you get sucked into the game experience (unless that is you come across screenshots of what it could look like :tear: )



#13 Simplex

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 01:32

Yeah, there are exactly ZERO credible and verifiable reports of AA working on modern nvidia cards, which is a huge shame. I play on a 55'' TV so the jaggies are very visible and distracting.

 

The only hope is porting the iOS remaster to PC.


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#14 trentjaspar

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 16:46

So...the original post in the old forums (undreaming.com) is gone along with the domain.  Does anybody have the old content?


"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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#15 Olstyle

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 21:42

I think I remember(that's a very German saying, does this even make sense in English?) playing on my old GTX 280 using OGSSAA(its like Downsampling/DSR/VSR for 3D objects only) via nHancer, but I might be mistaken.

#16 Simplex

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 21:47

I think AA worked on some very old nvidia drivers.

#17 Olstyle

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 21:58

OGSSAA is a really "dumb" way to go about smoothing edges, which could mean it doesn't include the pitfalls that are making some objects disappear with (SG)MSAA.

#18 Simplex

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 22:04

If OGSSAA worked on current drivers, somebody would have discovered it by now. Many people have been trying to enable MSAA in TLJ on nvidia cards for years, to no avail.

#19 Olstyle

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 22:19

The point is OGSSAA(ordered grid super sampling anti aliasing) is no (SG)MSAA([sparsed grid] multi sampling anti aliasing).
Still you might very well be right. I'm just trying to help ;).

#20 Simplex

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Posted 31 March 2015 - 23:37

OGSSAA is a really "dumb" way to go about smoothing edges, which could mean it doesn't include the pitfalls that are making some objects disappear with (SG)MSAA.

All this is true, the only problem is that the objects still disappear when using OGSSAA (specifically "2x2 (2x2 Supersampling)" option in nVidia inspector. The behavior is identical, no matter what AA type is used - MSAA, OGSSAA, or SGSSAA.

 

I wonder if anyone experimented with injecting FXAA or SMAA (FXAA set from nvidia control panel does not work). I assume someone did, and it did not work, otherwise we'd hear about it.






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