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Zoe's Body Disappears

zoe body dream disappears vanishes

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#61 conundra

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 11:09

I think Zoe is in storytime. She may fade in stark because of the fading current of magic in Arcadia. The Azadi pipes and engines are blocking the flow of magic between all worlds. 

But what I wonder is where her body was before she appeared in Storytime? She wasn't a dreamer before? Is it that she become a stronger dreamer after she went into coma?


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#62 Abnoxious

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 11:55

I haven't got much more to speculate about on this, buuuut I'm just hoping Zoe projections meet and fall in love and run away together forgetting about Wati-crap. 


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just a forum ghost


#63 Quatipu

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 12:14

I like this one.
But if we assume that there is only ever one body and one projection, dreaming in Dreamfall wouldn't work since she always left a body(second projection?) behind.

 

There is another clue: Even the wakening in Stark in chapter 1 would just be her altering the dream of her being in a coma. (Is it her dream or the dream of somebody else?) If Zoe is from Storytime then there would be no bodies in Stark and/or Arcadia at all. Question is, why does she sometimes appear to vanish and sometimes appear to be sleeping? I have no answer to that, but I speculate that it might have something to do with the worlds she is leaving to. Sometimes she changes via Winter and/or Storytime and sometimes directly between Stark and Arcadia.


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#64 CmputrBlu

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 13:09

Unless some events have taken place since she woke up from the coma that we've haven't seen yet; I can't help wonder if Zoe didn't come out of the coma and actually died. Zoe's story has been altered to allow her to come out of Storytime to make things right. If that makes any sense. The bigger picture in Stark may be the same; but what are we to make of the individuals that Zoe comes in contact with; of the people who help her. With Zoe being who/what she is; how much of happens to her (at least in Stark) should we view like a dream?


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"A dream within a dream - I'm impressed."


#65 dreamer_04

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 19:03

There is something special about Propast. I don't mean those mysterious towers. Hanna is a Dreamer. Maybe from Arcadia. Quennie can be Kin. Green or Red. The little girl which Zoe saved in Storytime lived in Propast.

There are probably no dragons currently active in this storyline, at least for the moment. The Blue is still asleep at the bottom of the ocean in Arcadia, Green (McAllen) and Red (Cortez) are presumably dead or at least waiting until they revive. And something happened to the White at the end of Dreamfall which took her out of the picture, at least for the time being. But it is interesting that that company in Casablanca which Zoe infiltrates in Dreamfall has a red dragon sigil as a brand motif or something. So there's definitely something going on there.

But the theory in the OP sounds too plausible for my taste, I hope it's not true, cause if it is, Zoe is probably gonna fade and disappear in the ending and I don't want that. :((((



#66 inspector

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 21:05

Zoe's body is probably already dead but she can dream herself to anywhere now.



#67 Clairobscur

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 21:16

Zoe's body is probably already dead but she can dream herself to anywhere now.

 

I am also leaning towards this idea since Book Three.



#68 CPAwesome

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 21:49

There are probably no dragons currently active in this storyline, at least for the moment. The Blue is still asleep at the bottom of the ocean in Arcadia, Green (McAllen) and Red (Cortez) are presumably dead or at least waiting until they revive. And something happened to the White at the end of Dreamfall which took her out of the picture, at least for the time being. But it is interesting that that company in Casablanca which Zoe infiltrates in Dreamfall has a red dragon sigil as a brand motif or something. So there's definitely something going on there.

 

Actually, IIRC, the White told us that the Blue has been killed.  In Dreamfall, I remember her telling April that something was killing off dragons, and that when the Blue was killed, the White went into hiding.  After April left, the White was attacked by something.  The most prevalent theory, at the time at least, was that Brian Westhouse was the attacker--or rather, the Undreaming that is apparently inside him.  The White's appearance in Book One as a ghost would seem to indicate that she was, in fact, killed.

 

I never noticed Waticorp using a red dragon as a brand.  THAT's extremely interesting.  Does anyone else remember this?  If it's true, it would seem to connect Cortez to Waticorp in some way--which would be odd, given that Cortez has definitely been painted as a good character and Wati has definitely been presented as evil.

 

Another symbol that this drew my attention to: it's probably been mentioned before, but I just remembered that the symbol of Hanna's gang is the dragonfly, and that Queenie is seen making some kind of artificial dragonfly sculpture (or robot or something) in her lap.  It seems likely that Hanna got the symbol from Queenie, and her association with the symbol (a DRAGON-fly) is further evidence of the theory going around that Queenie is one of the Kin.  I think that's the camp I'm in, now--the "Queenie is a Kin" camp.

 

All of this is, of course, way off-topic--but I'm okay with that if you folks are :D


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#69 dreamer_04

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 22:16

Here it is, a red dragon symbol in WATI HQ. http://tlj.wikia.com...Wati_dragon.png
Now that you mention it, I do remember something about the Blue, but I'm not sure he was killed, I think it had fallen under the radar. Ah, here it is, from the wiki, with direct quote: "Ten years after April's journey, something has begun hunting the Draic Kin: an enemy that is "not mortal" according to the White Dragon reborn. The Old God has apparently fallen victim to it, because she cannot hear him any more. This does not seem to have affected the Dark People, and their Library remains a sanctuary, but April is surprised and unnerved to hear this news.

However, there is no evidence that the Blue of the Kin is actually dead. According to the White Dragon, he has only "gone silent"."



#70 Pawlo_86

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 22:18

Eingana was red in beta Dreamfall.

http://s24.photobuck...ml?t=1255737001

#71 Quatipu

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Posted 28 June 2015 - 22:21

I think the White says something like "She cannot hear the blue one anymore and she is not sure if he is still with them/he has gone silent." This might imply that the blue draic kin is dead, but this is only speculation.

edit: @dreamer_04 was faster ;)



#72 Roseweave

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 04:34

The "dreaming a very physical body" actually has a strong foundation in folklore and various strands of shamanism/witchcraft. we often tend to think of things as spirits, but some cultures believed they were literally becoming physical wolves, etc. projecting a physical body(or hijacking one). There was often talk of having more than one body, one of which you'd use to interact with the "other world". So while Zoë's ability seems different to how "projection" is normally shown in fantasy/sci-fi, where it's more of a spirit body, often translucent or possessing other tells of not really being there, the idea of Zoë being able to conjure a physical body does fit; let's also not forget that if reality is made from dreams to begin with, she's basically just hacking herself a copy.


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#73 Clairobscur

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 09:00

After some thinking, I am not sure about Zoë's body being dead. That Book Two ending with Zoë in the hospital is very confusing. It would mean there are three Zoës: Storytime Zoë, Hospital Zoë and Propast/Arcadia Zoë. We have already seen three Zoës at the beginning of DFC in Storytime when DFC Zoë argues with DF Zoë while Hospital Zoë is lying on her bed. It might be a clue that Zoë is now able to be at more than two different places at once.

But if that's the case, what is the purpose of Hospital Zoë?

 

I'd rather think her body is in someone's care, possibly Fraulein and that Falk watches over dreamt up Zoë in Propast for her. About Falk: as it means Falcon, I can't help but wonder if he is the Crow of Stark. They both fulfil the same "guardian angel" part. They both help Zoë in remembering.

 

Now about Fräulein's identity. Roman's office is in a very expensive building, he has very expensive furniture that he could not afford without some extra money. If Fräulein is Gilmore, no doubt that WATI has the means to pay Roman. I am not sure Helena Chang would have that kind of money. In one KS update, it was stated that Falk is working for WATI. However he watches over Zoë and saves her from death. As the Syndicate is working for WATI, why would Gilmore want to kill Propast Zoë if her body is in her care?

I had this crazy idea he might be a double agent and officially working for Gilmore while actually reporting to Fräulein.

 

I also had this other idea that Olivia could be Fräulein and the one in care of Zoë's body.


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#74 CmputrBlu

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 12:37

If Zoe's it still alive and still in the coma back in Casablanca then I can't help think that either all or a part of Propast is actually Zoe's dream. (otherwise you have two Zoe's and that gets awkward when she contacts someone in Casablanca only to be told she's actually in a coma)  Maybe she created this world as a defense against what happen to her. Or maybe the Undreaming prevented her from doing what she was suppose to do after she left Storytime. And maybe like in real dreams some of the people we've met are really aspects of Zoe. And if Queenie is the White Dragon then she's there because she got taken/trapped by the same thing back in Dreamfall.

 

Nah, I'm sure none of this is actually what is going on :)


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"A dream within a dream - I'm impressed."


#75 ChrisR

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 13:31

I really don't like the idea of Zoe dying, but I think Ragnar mentioned that her story would be over in this game.

#76 Vincy85

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 13:41

I think Zoë is stil in Casablanca in coma or dead(maybe as Faith) and her soul of whatever dreams a projection of herself in Stark or Arcadia. The story of Zoë finish with Dreamfall Chapters so she could be dead...i'm still a bit confused about her anyway.



#77 Pawlo_86

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 13:44

From Book One we know that at the end of her journey Zoe will return to Storytime. I think that she will acompany/replace Vagabond.

#78 Vincy85

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 13:45

From Book One we know that at the end of her journey Zoe will return to Storytime. I think that she will acompany/replace Vagabond.

Vagabond says her: we met for one last time. So she could be dead...


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#79 Pawlo_86

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 13:54

Yes Zoe can be dead but still what about her story from end of Dreamfall? Was she able to change some events? Are Chapters a story which she told Vagabond?

#80 Vincy85

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 14:02

Yes Zoe can be dead but still what about her story from end of Dreamfall? Was she able to change some events? Are Chapters a story which she told Vagabond?

Zoë's soul or whatever could travel between Worlds could change the future and win the war but she just dream. I don't think a dead woman could dream, so she's in coma then after she reach her goal she could rest in peace. But it's my opinion


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