12 replies to this topic

[yodagreen3]

There may be several threads like this already, there may be a more appropriate place to post this within another thread. ( But I'm posting it here anyways)   

Well I'm going to just be honest. What puts me off about this saga ... Dreamfall was a pretty decent game turning away from the beloved protagonist of the first game. In some ways the character of April Ryan was developed, as she was intermingled in the story of another lead protagonist,  but the character also faced severe changes. The character's story went into a very different direction. You might say that it had to, after she discovered she wasn't "the chosen one". There had to be a different direction for the character. 

There is no one way , direction the series had to go in. The writers could take it in any direction. I feel that video games always have one or a few favorite, relatable characters. April Ryan was my favorite character. To be honest when I get into a movie series or video game series, I do like the characters involved, often I like the main protagonist the story is centered around. Again, the game changed directions and the writers had every right to take it in whatever direction they wanted.

Granted this game is DreamFall The Longest Journey, suggesting it's another "adventure" within the series. April does change a lot, she has a long and full complex story between TLJ and Dreamfall. We don't really see a lot of that.We see a very changed character, and then she dies a rather lifeless death on screen.  

Spoiler

Then the start of Dream Fall Chapters comes. April Ryan is indeed dead. Which honestly disappointed me. Dreamfall was made in 2006 so animation and CGI wasn't the greatest. It didn't allow for the emotion and depth we see in Chapters.But, the scene where April dies is the most undramatic, abrupt death scene of any main protagonist I've ever seen. No close up of April's face, no dramatic music... no emotion.. just ran through, falls backwards into a lake... By far it was one of the most disappointing things I've ever seen.

Any emotion the player feels for the character, isn't really inspired much through the game design. The first game actually has more emotional content with its video content and voice acting dialogs and that was a 2D game with barely any close ups. The reactions are terrible. I know it's just a game, that's why I'm able to hold it to my own standards. Like any one else I can play it, enjoy it or choose not to. I'm drawn to a game for it's story, emotional content and main characters. In this case the story at this point is weak, the emotional content is weak and the scene is done poorly. 

Spoiler

She basically dies, Kian barely murmurs or even gasps... the expression on his face barely changes... he might stutter... Zoe makes an awkward face and then that's basically it.

Next time we see her she's in a casket and nearly everyone is shocked that she's actually dead because the scene in Dreamfall wasn't convincing or truly satisfying to begin with. 

 I started Chapters , I'm still on chapters one. I love the first game, I liked the second game enough. Longest Journey Home might give her story more depth and meaning but I still have to accept that she dies in a very abrupt and what I personally felt was a very lifeless, 2 dimensional way...

I understand that the game may add more dimension to her part, role in the series in Chapters. They may develop it further, I certainly hope so.

 

[Vainamoinen]

http://redthreadgame...e-make-of-her/

[Riaise]

Shouldn't the parts about Chapters be in spoiler tags? It's just that there are people who may read this part of the forum who haven't played Chapters yet and end up being spoiled unintentionally.

[khh]

Nah, it's in the spoiler subforum and it's a long time since Book One was out. It's fine.

[agirlnamedbob]

I think that the spoiler concern is more because this is the "TLJ" area, not the "DFC" area. 

[khh]

It's the TLJ saga. I'd still say that if you haven't played DFC Book One yet, you shouldn't be in any forum that says "Spoiler Warning!". 

[agirlnamedbob]

Fair, but I did make the distinction in the Spoiler Policy and it seems sort of pointless to have a separate section if this includes DFC, Also, the description of this section is "Discuss the story and lore from The Longest Journey and Dreamfall: The Longest Journey." No mention of Chapters. 

 

Just my two cents.

[khh]

I went back and checked, looks like we forgot this section when we were discussing the official spoiler policy. So .. I don't know. Should we go back and discuss it?

[yodagreen3]

I'll just spoiler tag it until  it's been decided. That way there's no immediate harm involved from here on.

Spoiler

 I've edited the title for those who haven't played Dream Fall Chapters yet. What bothers me is not so much the character change, it's more so the fact that her death scene is so utterly disappointing and flat. I could accept the change. It may evolve Kian's story, give it more depth but it wasn't a fair way to end April's story... 

This is kind of half a spoiler as April Ryan dies in game two of the TLJ series, even though it's surprising that is her actual death scene

 

[magic88889]

Spoiler

I think it's a storytelling choice.  In real life, death is just a part of it.  It's not momentous, there's no fanfare.  So sometimes, the storyteller decides NOT to make a big deal about it.  It might be to the audience, but to the story, and the characters there, it's not really a big deal.  Just one more rebel dead, and a lot of them died that day.  Zoe didn't really know April, and neither did Kian.  Plus Kian had a lot on his mind just then. 

 

It's a choice I've seen done elsewhere (most notably in Game of Thrones, but elsewhere too), and it adds something to the narrative.  It's a choice to do it that way.  Not everyone's going to like it, but I think the fact that her death was so casual made it even more distressing.

[urzagc13]

Well, not surprisingly (given my other posts concerning April), but I quite disagree with your analysis, yodagreen, and here's why:

 

Spoiler

First of all, I personally found the scene more than enough "dramatic" (and shocking!) back at the day when I first played Dreamfall in 2006. And I think it is the lack of those things you mentioned (no sad music, all around "muted" reactions, etc.) that made it even more so. The lack of these elements is actually used as a "tool" to maximize the impact of April being "brutally cut down", as the recap video describes it, because this turn of events is totally unexpected, we're all "certain" that something else is going to happen (Zoe will use her Dreamer powers to save her, April will regain her shifter powers, Kian will do some heroic move, etc.) but ... it doesn't. We - the audience - are left speechless, frozen, in shock, unable to believe what just happened (we still spent 8 more years debating impossible ways about how she could still be alive) and the uneasy, eerie feeling is mirrored by the direction of this scene, the lack of sound, as if all creation paused at what had just occured ("as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced" as Star Wars would put it). That technique is frequently used in films as well with similarly great dramatic effects. But I see that it didn't work for you in this case though.

 

My second point of disagreement is the "usual" one: I don't think that her death scene is April's "final" moment, but instead I hold an almost "religious" faith in Ragnar's handling of her story that I know that her "death" there is nothing but a stepping stone to what's coming next, her literal "darkest/lowest moment", but necessary in order for her light to shine brighter/her fire to grow hotter in comparison when she completes the cycle and pulls a Gandalf on us. So, I don't put that much significance on this scene as you do (and I also found her funeral in Dreamfall: Chapters to be incredibly moving and appropriate). Yes, that "death" was unsatisfying (or better, it would be unsatisfying if that was actually the end of April) but I think it was so by (careful) design, because it is NOT the end, but merely the middle of the Journey.

 

To conclude I'll use a quote from another of my most favorite stories of all time (the anime TV series Puella Magi Madoka Magica):

"If someone ever tells me it's a mistake to have hope then I'll just tell them they're wrong and I'll keep telling them until they believe, no matter how many times it takes."

So, don't lose hope, trust the Balance, (trust Ragnar) and trust yourself. 

Thus says I, a "hardcore" April-fan since 1999.   

[yodagreen3]

Spoiler

I appreciate the responses. I'm really kind of bipolar when it comes to discussing these things.  It makes discussing these topics difficult for me and others. I was shocked and angry by the scene.  Also I was hopeful that it wasn't the end. I do see what both of you saw. I was angered by how abrupt it was, shocked when it happened. But then I felt a little disappointed and just hoped it wasn't the end. The scene was some what effective in it's own way. I can't deny that it shocked me. I didn't think much of it at the time because I thought April would return. In my mind I could make up anything so I told myself that she was alive and well. Living out the rest of her days in peace some place because all those who wanted her dead already assumed her to be dead. I also just thought it was a good way to end the series. April dies and the balance is totally out of whack, the world seems to be falling apart and on edge. I thought that it was a bold, daring ending. Not everything has a happy ending and I was impressed how unhappy a ending Dreamfall had. It helped me accept the shock factor of the ending of the game, which was all together shocking. Nothing ended well in Dreamfall  

 Maybe I just wanted to see her evolve more. I had begun to accept the changes she had gone through, only to see her killed off, killed before she found love, peace. Not in a very satisfying way. Quick death works for me in some cases, just not the first time I played Dreamfall. I admit that I felt sad for the character that she had endured so much. Part of me said " It's for her own good, she's sad anyways and the world is ending." That's kind of how I ratioanlized it when the game ended in complete chaos. That it was just all together a dark ending.

 At any rate, my opinions on things like this are never concrete which drives me insane. Though I also get to embrace change and having multi view points in my mind about something. I seriously can't make up my own mind about a lot of things and once I hear other perspectives I just open my mind and broaden what those things could mean.Which is why I hate giving my opinion some times because I rather just explore possibilities than limit myself to any one opinion. I do feel that I am a little limited here because I love the character of April Ryan so much. I really wanted to see more of her character and see how she evolved, changed. There's really not much more to discuss because we don't yet know how events will turn out. It's all irrelevant up to a point.  Anything can happen from here on. Maybe I just felt like complaining. I can't figure myself out yet. No woman alive can yet neither.  I love letting go of opinions though haha. I usually feel guilty when I give one. I do have solid opinions about some things but haha I tend to not like to have those. I do love April Ryan that is an opinion I stand by.  My mind goes off into too many different directions. Maybe this is why I can be god awful at arguing, defending certain things.    

 

[Tina]

I went back and checked, looks like we forgot this section when we were discussing the official spoiler policy. So .. I don't know. Should we go back and discuss it?

I guess I'm in the "since the title now has spoiler tags, I'm okay with it being discussed openly inside the thread" corner

 

If spoilers should somehow go into Book 2 territory, then I'll say spoiler tags inside thread.

 

But meh, I feel this is one of the edge cases of spoiler-land Hard to have a definitive answer. In any case, I feel the title now has a warning, so it's easy for people to steer clear if they want to